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5th Generation 4Runner Suspension Options Thread

Discussion in '5th Gen 4Runners (2010-2024)' started by koukimonster, Nov 11, 2020.

  1. Dec 9, 2020 at 6:45 PM
    #61
    thirdyota

    thirdyota shouldn't be trusted

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    You could use the Bilstein 36-281817 rear coils like I did. Pretty close to the advertised 1" of lift. I measured it at 7/8" with my non-precise means of eyeball and tape measure.
     
  2. Dec 10, 2020 at 8:33 AM
    #62
    koukimonster

    koukimonster [OP] DYNO4

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    Wonderful. Thanks guys! More reading to do now...

    So any thoughts on just using the Eibach shocks (or others) with OEM springs all around? I'd raise the front with the shock around an inch.

    I'm thinking about doing just that for now, and then maybe I'll put on the Eibach springs (or something else) a year or two down the road if/when I get larger tires.
     
    Last edited: Dec 10, 2020
  3. Dec 10, 2020 at 8:44 AM
    #63
    glwood54

    glwood54 Stop making me buy stuff!

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    I put the Eibach Sport struts & shocks on mine, with the stock springs. I put the front struts on the 2nd snap ring setting (.85) and it levelled my 4R nicely. The ride is great. I definitely recommend this setup.

    On one thread, I posted a long list of photos of different 4Rs with this (Bilstein mostly) setup.
     
  4. Dec 10, 2020 at 8:47 AM
    #64
    koukimonster

    koukimonster [OP] DYNO4

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    Btw, thanks again for everyone's help. It's not lost on me that I'm going around the world and then getting back to ending up with exactly what @nimby suggested in post #3, lol. Sorry, I'm that guy that can't just do, I must understand. We are difficult people I am sure lmao. Cheers
     
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  5. Dec 10, 2020 at 11:08 AM
    #65
    koukimonster

    koukimonster [OP] DYNO4

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    Hey @glwood54 , any idea what that thread was called or a link by chance? So, how would you compare your ride to with the stock shocks? Any noticeable difference, on or off road?
     
  6. Dec 10, 2020 at 11:12 AM
    #66
    Thatbassguy

    Thatbassguy New member? Really??

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    I'll bet a good number of us have gone back and forth on these decisions. There's nothing wrong with learning about multiple options before choosing. It's probably best in the long run.

    I did the same and have no complaints about my setup. It behaves as expected because I did the research to know what I was getting.

    I imagine you will be happy with what you choose for the same reason. :)
     
  7. Dec 10, 2020 at 11:29 AM
    #67
    thirdyota

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    Ha ha...I changed my mind a least a thousand times before I purchased my set up.

    I had actually bought something else first, but thanks to the extreme COVID delays I was able to cancel it before they shipped it to me. So...it all worked out. :)
     
  8. Dec 10, 2020 at 11:40 AM
    #68
    koukimonster

    koukimonster [OP] DYNO4

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    Do you have any pics of your setup, @thirdyota ? It looks like you have 285s, right?

    From the more I look, I wish I could get a .5" rear lift, preferably from a new spring, in the rear. I don't think I want to use a spacer in the rear since I like to do some off-roading/climbing.

    With 285s I'm pretty much sold on a 1" rear lift.

    So I suppose I'll just keep the rear springs as is until I have larger tires, unless I find some spring that lifts only 1/2".

    We'll see. I need to look closely at it next time we go camping (which won't be until the spring). I didn't notice it sagging too much, but didn't look closely or anything. Honestly our camping gear isn't too heavy, anyway. The full Yeti 65 is most of the weight. I'll just hate it if I end up with negative rake after lifting the front a bit then loading down the rear a bit. Guess I'll just have to upgrade springs if that happens and peg-leg it around town when not camping lol..
     
  9. Dec 10, 2020 at 11:45 AM
    #69
    thirdyota

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    I have stock size tires...265/70/17. The Nitto Ridge Grapplers look pretty beefy for the size.

    What type of photos...like a side shot?
     
  10. Dec 10, 2020 at 11:46 AM
    #70
    koukimonster

    koukimonster [OP] DYNO4

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    Oh, nice! Yeah just the standard side shot is what I'm going by. Thanks! Would be great if I could convince myself to go with a 1" rear spring lift and then be happy with the results lol.
     
  11. Dec 10, 2020 at 1:46 PM
    #71
    thirdyota

    thirdyota shouldn't be trusted

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    Here's a before and an after...
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    I have since lowered the front a bit because I felt it looked a little too high even though my measurements indicated just about dead level. I don't have any photos since I lowered the front.

    I'm running Elka 2.0 IFP (2-3" adjustable w/650# springs) coilovers in the front and the matching Elka shocks in the rear with the Bilstein springs I mentioned above.
     
  12. Dec 10, 2020 at 2:51 PM
    #72
    nimby

    nimby in the drink

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    I don't know of anyone that makes a 0.5" lift coil for the rear of our vehicles so you could either use a spacer to achieve that height, get the Eibach rear load leveling system (essentially a spacer so you might as well just get a spacer), or go up to the 1" lift height with a coil.

    Also, you don't need a 1" lift to run 285's in the rear. There's plenty of clearance back there at stock height with 285's......but if you prefer it, that's fine too.

    Just giving you options.
     
  13. Dec 10, 2020 at 10:09 PM
    #73
    glwood54

    glwood54 Stop making me buy stuff!

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    Sure. It was this post:

    https://www.4runners.com/threads/bilstein-5100s-pics-with-settings.12877/#post-138153

    in this thread:

    https://www.4runners.com/threads/bilstein-5100s-pics-with-settings.12877/

    I managed to collect 23 photos of rigs all over the place with Bilstein lifts, mostly just at .85 in the front.

    The ride was improved in my opinion. A tad firmer, but not harsh in any way. I haven't had much of a chance to off road during all the virus mess, but a few forays into the hills around town did not show any reason to not like the Eibach setup.
     
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  14. Dec 10, 2020 at 10:16 PM
    #74
    glwood54

    glwood54 Stop making me buy stuff!

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    @nimby nailed this one. No one makes a spring to lift that little. Seeing as how the Eibach rear shocks are designed for their Pro Truck lift, which uses a rear 1" lift spring, you wouldn't be limiting the shock by putting in a .5" or 1" spacer.
     
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  15. Dec 11, 2020 at 2:43 PM
    #75
    thirdyota

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    Another before and after comparison. The after pic is with the front adjusted a tiny bit lower. The difference is subtle...but I think it's right where I want it now.
    [​IMG]


    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2020
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  16. Dec 11, 2020 at 5:50 PM
    #76
    nimby

    nimby in the drink

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    Did you specify you wanted 650lb coils with your purchase or do those come stock on the 2.0's?
     
  17. Dec 11, 2020 at 9:49 PM
    #77
    Thatbassguy

    Thatbassguy New member? Really??

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    I can see the difference. I think you made the right call. Looks good!
     
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  18. Dec 11, 2020 at 11:25 PM
    #78
    thirdyota

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    I chose 650lb.
     
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  19. Dec 12, 2020 at 8:50 AM
    #79
    nimby

    nimby in the drink

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    Do those automatically come with 700lb coils?

    How are you liking the ride? Are you happy with the 650's?
     
  20. Dec 12, 2020 at 10:13 AM
    #80
    thirdyota

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    When ordering from Headstrong Off-Road you have to choose a spring rate. The ride with the 650's is perfect IMO.

    Notably firmer than factory, but not too stiff at all.
     
    Last edited: Dec 12, 2020
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  21. Dec 16, 2020 at 10:25 AM
    #81
    koukimonster

    koukimonster [OP] DYNO4

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    OK.. Analysis paralysis much?? lol
    This post is partly just so I can keep all of this data organized somewhere..

    I'm still mulling all this over as the days pass and Christmas nears. Man.. this Holiday Season just doesn't seem as "glitzy," huh? Freaking 2020...

    Anyway, I'm currently looking for front lift springs that lift from +1.5" to +2.0". Any suggestions there are super appreciated! So far I think I've only found one spring that lifts that amount, which to me, seems crazy. Max lift without messing with UCA's, and allows a slightly larger tire? Why aren't manufacturers jumping on this? Guess it's not "wow" enough for the mall-crawler crowd.. (kidding, partially, lol).

    I like the forward rake look and function, so I want to preserve some of it. I do not want to preserve all of it, though, because to me that ruins the look of the truck, after lift, unless you have large rear tires (33"+). When I look at stock rear tires on a 2" rear lift, all I can see is a coin feeding into a coin slot for some reason. So if the stock rake is ~1.75", I'm aiming to keep 1" of rake. This means that I need a front lift that is .75" larger than the rear lift.

    So I'm torn between going with just some adjustable struts up front, set to +.85", and upgraded shocks in the rear (Bilstein or Eibach.. Probably Eibach), all with the OE springs.. OR going with a full setup of 4 new lift springs and new shocks/struts. As much as I don't want to be ass-high around town, part of me feels like the *function* of a lift in the rear might really come in handy when loaded with camping gear and flexing in the forests, etc. We really don't have a lot of gear that's heavy though, and I don't see myself adding a whole lot of weight to the truck itself, so I'm right on that "line," and I'm having difficulty deciding whether or not need to lift the rear. Is the stock rear suspension sufficient for handling our gear? Surely. But I also have slightly larger tires, so I wonder if I need more room..

    Then there is the issue of which rear spring? Obviously I want as little rear lift as possible. But personally, I'd also like to have all 4 springs built by the same manufacturer.. and that's where it gets really hard. So maybe I shouldn't be so concerned there? I suppose that in a perfect world I could just compare spring rates, or thickness and length, etc.. but from my experience, different manufacturers "measure" and test their products differently, so even comparing spring rates probably isn't apples to apples. I feel like if I go with the same brand, the rears and fronts have probably been designed, and tested, together. I also feel safer comparing spring rates in that case. I digress.. that may not be an option.

    Rear Coil Spring Options:
    - Wheeler's Off-Road T13 :: Advertised 1.5" 381mm 200lb/in ("195lb/in" but also "+12% stiffer than stock")
    - Dobinsons C59-599 :: Advertised 1-1.25" 390mm 220lb/in
    - Eibach Pro-Lift :: Advertised 1" ???mm 200lb/in ("10% stiffer than stock")
    - Bilstein B12 (817) :: Advertised 1" ???mm 200lb/in ("10% stiffer than stock")

    Both of the Dobinsons and Eibach offerings seem to measure (real world) taller than they claim. The Wheeler's and Bilstein seem pretty accurate. The Wheeler's might even measure a little shorter than claimed. Of course, every truck seems to have it's own personality there.

    It appears that the Dobinsons springs are stiffer, but supposedly Dobinson measured the TRD Pro rear spring to be 220 lb/in, which as we all know is incorrect (they are ~180 lb/in just like the regular TRD and SR5 springs), so that leads me to think that maybe their measuring devices are calibrated differently. Ok.. so then does that mean that their front springs are actually softer than they say they are? See what I mean re. comparing different brands?! Maybe the Dobinsons really are a little stiffer than the others, which would attribute to them measuring higher than expected by various owners on the interwebs.

    So if I decide to lift the rear of the truck it will be with a spring, and those are my options. Well, it seems like there are at least a few options for the rear, which is good. But now I've realized that the front might be even more difficult, lol, since I don't want an adjustable setup, and it seems like most front springs lift 2.5" which is more than I want.

    Since the front is more difficult to install than the rear, and requires an alignment post-install, I am leaning toward choosing a front spring first, installing it, and THEN taking measurements and photos before I decide on a rear spring to match. Something tells me that I might have to try more than one rear spring before I get it exactly as I want. IF I go that route. Decisions, decisions...
     
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2020
  22. Dec 16, 2020 at 4:15 PM
    #82
    nimby

    nimby in the drink

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    You are correct. You are over analyzing this. :)

    From the sounds of it, I think this would be the set-up the fits your needs closest:

    Toytec 1.6" front lift coils paired with Eibach adjustable front shocks set to the 0" setting (because the coils are providing the lift)
    Eibach 1" rear lift coil paired with Eibach rear shocks

    Substitute the rear Eibach coils for the B12's if you like or Bilstein 5100 shocks all around for the Eibach shocks if you like the ride a bit firmer.

    It's not your 0.75" lift ratio but rather a 0.6" ratio. Will you be able to distinguish the 0.15" difference? Maybe if you have a very good eye and park on perfectly level ground all the time. :hattip:
     
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  23. Dec 17, 2020 at 1:23 PM
    #83
    koukimonster

    koukimonster [OP] DYNO4

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    Thanks again, @nimby ! You're right on the money, as usual. I've all but decided to go with a full spring setup instead of just struts/shocks. The typical ".85 front setting Bilstein/Eibach with stock rear" setup looks nice, but honestly I'm already wanting more than that (lol) especially with my slightly larger tires. It also oddly looks a bit too level for my tastes.. maybe. Every truck is different and so it's like the pics hardly help.

    Anyway, thank you for pointing out those Toytec coils. I actually saw those on Toytec's website during my research, but they claimed 2.5" or something like that on a 4th Gen 4R and had no data listed for the 5th Gen, so I assumed they were too tall! EDIT: Looked closely and now I see that the 5th Gen 4R is listed.. It just doesn't get it's own bullet point so I missed it ha.

    I've also discovered the OME 2883 spring and have added it to the list. Unfortunately, it looks like OME's associated rear spring offering, the 895e, is too stiff for my liking @ 260lb/in, so I'd have to mix the OME front spring with a different brand rear. Maybe no biggie.

    Front Coil Spring Options:
    - OME 2883 :: (Not)Advertised 1.75-2" 375mm 590lb/in
    - Dobinsons C59-300 :: Advertised 1.75" 385mm 586lb/in
    - Toytec 112-620-P :: Advertised 1.6" ???mm 620lb/in

    Any other low lift springs (front or rear) that you guys know of?? Thanks!

    Right now I'm still worrying that all of these options will leave me with too much forward rake. I need a 2" front lift! I bet one of these will work.. need to decide now. *Back to Google for more pics*
     
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  24. Dec 18, 2020 at 8:09 AM
    #84
    nimby

    nimby in the drink

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    Just to warn you, there are so many variables when it comes to analyzing lift pictures. Were they on level ground? Is their horizon straight? Is the picture a straight side shot? All these nuanced things can make a truck look very different in a picture than they do in person. Just keep that in mind.

    So you're wanting 2" in the front and 1" in the back? Is that what you're after?
     
  25. Dec 18, 2020 at 8:20 AM
    #85
    Chris In Milwaukee

    Chris In Milwaukee New Member

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    If you want to "see" what they look like, if you check out my build thread, on the first page you'll see my before and after for the 2.5/1.5 lift. Then, of course, you can visualize (or Photoshop :p) 1/2" off of it and get the idea. I'm running stock sized tires on mine.
     
  26. Dec 18, 2020 at 9:02 AM
    #86
    koukimonster

    koukimonster [OP] DYNO4

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    Yeah I am aware and agree, which is why this is taking so long lol. In the end, yes, it may be a decision based upon "trusting the data" rather than pics. I'll see one setup and it'll look great, then I'll see it again and think "ehhh." I'm doing my best to control for the variables lol... (actual) tire size, ground levelness, weight added to the truck.. of course a lot of that isn't listed most of the time either. Fortunately, these trucks are super popular in the aftermarket crowd, so there are a fair bit of photos. At the same time, there are so many choices, and the specs I'm after are not the popular choice. I think most wisely go with a mild lift for the street via struts front, and shocks plus a spacer (or nothing) in the rear... or go full fledged 3/2 lift for off-roading with 285's (and hopefully new UCA's from what I'm reading). The mild off-roading lift on 275's or stock tires is certainly rarer around here. It's also pretty common for guys to do a winch/bumper up front, which further increases the spring options IMO. I don't plan to add much weight.

    2/1.25 is what I'm after. I think it's possible but it'll almost be down to luck. I've definitely seen guys achieve what I'm after, however it's usually not their intention lol... it's usually because a spring didn't raise their truck as much as they thought it would. Then there are the guys using the exact same setup but their rear appears an entire inch higher for.. who knows why? The joys. :)

    I'm not so picky that I'll obsess over .25" differences, but I'd like the rake to be in the 1" range. I don't want to dwarf my tires so the smallest spring lift possible, while achieving that 1" rake, is my goal.

    If I buy a front spring that is listed at +2" and it gives me 2.5", I'll be annoyed. If I buy a rear spring that's listed at 1.5" and I get 2", I'll be a little annoyed. But at least the rear springs are easily swappable. Since I'm so particular I've pretty much accepted that I *might* have to swap the rear springs again if they're too tall (or short).
     
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2020
  27. Dec 18, 2020 at 9:06 AM
    #87
    koukimonster

    koukimonster [OP] DYNO4

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    Yikes! That is a big reason why I will probably end up going with Dobinsons struts/shocks. I don't yet understand the point of making an adjustable shock (though obviously it does appeal to the 4Runner owner that wants an inexpensive lift option). I don't think there is necessarily anything wrong with them, but I do think there is better. Eibach is still in the running, though. They cost a little less. I think I'd like the Dobinson design more though, as it's closer to OE and, IMO, maybe better for off-road use and the "feel" that I'm after.
     
  28. Dec 18, 2020 at 9:38 AM
    #88
    HondaKen

    HondaKen New Member

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    I just got my dobinsons front extended travel shocks in the mail. I'm pretty curious how these will ride as well. I personally will be using stock coils with these, but it'll provide about 1 inch lift in the front, so is claimed. I might go toss them on today, but it's kind of chilly, so might do it in the morning , regardless...but I can provide some ride quality input hopefully by tomorrow afternoon.
     
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  29. Dec 18, 2020 at 9:57 AM
    #89
    koukimonster

    koukimonster [OP] DYNO4

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    Bigger A/T LT Tires, Slight Lift, Sliders, Rack, Lights, etc.
    Killer! So the Dobinsons front strut spring seat is an inch higher than stock, I guess? EDIT: Just saw that you said "extended." So is that how the extended strut works? The seat is an inch higher, and the strut extends an inch longer (or something like that)?

    That's another variable that most don't think about. Bilstein strut's spring seat might not be exactly where Dobinsons spring seat is, correct? At least it appears that way to me in the photos of the struts. So really your strut choice in the front affects your lift amount, even if you're using the "0" setting on adjustable. I imagine it's a small amount, but if you get a little extra from your strut's spring seat that you weren't expecting, PLUS the coil you chose lifts a little more than you were expecting, those differences could add up to a lift that's way higher than you wanted. At least.. it seems that way to me.

    Would be awesome obviously to go to a 4Runner meet and see various lift setups in person ha.
     
    Last edited: Dec 18, 2020
  30. Dec 18, 2020 at 10:15 AM
    #90
    HondaKen

    HondaKen New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2020
    Member:
    #18082
    Messages:
    109
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Ken
    WI
    Vehicle:
    2021 blue SR5 Premium
    TRD pro wheels, 12volt solutions remote start, dobinsons fronts
    I believe it'd be more like, the seat is a half inch higher, which would be like 7/8-1 inch of lift, and extended another half inch, or something like that. I've done nearly every type of lift and many brands over the years, and haven't tried Dobs, but from what I've read, these seem to be what I'm looking for. That said...right now I want it stock, basically, just for a good all around driver..but I never end up that way...:facepalm:
     
    koukimonster[OP] likes this.

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