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Why so little talk about Limited/Nightshade models?

Discussion in '5th Gen 4Runners (2010+)' started by elkin, Aug 10, 2019.

  1. Aug 10, 2019 at 4:02 AM
    #1
    elkin

    elkin [OP] New Member

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    I've been going to various Toyota dealerships and test driving various 4Runner models for the last 3 weeks. I'm waiting for the 2020 Limited/Nightshade model to arrive as that is the one I'm planning to purchase.

    But I wanted to ask this forum, how come the Limited models appear to have such little conversation around them? It seems almost all talk is geared toward the TRD Pro & Off-Road as well as the SR5.

    As someone who will be using his 4Runner in both the city as well as offroad (nothing too extreme), is the Limited a smart choice? What warnings or negatives would some of you say apply to the Limited? Any reasons not to go with this particular model? My personal gripe with the Limited is it doesn't sit as high as the other models, but I like the nicer interior (leather seats).

    Thanks in advance for any insight or advice.
     
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  2. Aug 10, 2019 at 5:21 AM
    #2
    Jynarik

    Jynarik I like fat booty

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    I think reality is most of your soccer moms drive them.

    Not to say there aren’t plenty of people who buy them and use them for outlanding, just not as common
     
  3. Aug 10, 2019 at 5:48 AM
    #3
    Braves95

    Braves95 New Member

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    Well I have the 19 nightshade.
    It is a little more pricier than the others for 1. But I am adding the kings to it. Just have to find time to do so. Had them since February. But I do believe you lose the crawl control. But again all time 4wd. When lifting the truck on the limited you don't need to do the needle bearing like the others.
    I do like the interior better. And I haven't figured out the cooling seats. For some reason it doesn't work as well as I would like.
     
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  4. Aug 10, 2019 at 9:43 AM
    #4
    redneckj

    redneckj New Member

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    Please elaborate on needing to "do the needle bearings like others".



    The creature comforts of the limited are really nice. Those comforts should be available on the Pro along with the FOX shocks and a skid plate for the additional PRO mark up $$$$.
     
  5. Aug 10, 2019 at 9:47 AM
    #5
    Braves95

    Braves95 New Member

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    Because the limited is all time 4 wheel drive you don't need to do the needle bearing if lifting. But on the other 4eunners and the tacomas when you lift the truck you should replace the needle bearing on the driver side. To the clamshell from ECGS (East Coast Gear Supply) so you dont get a wobble feel.
     
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  6. Aug 10, 2019 at 10:04 AM
    #6
    Toffees

    Toffees New Member

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    LE is a beast of the truck, like all of the 4R models, but it naturally appeals to a different crowd. Swap the 20s for 17s and put on ATs and it will do what the other models will do, although the ground clearance is a little worse. It's certainly a capable model, and most of the mods that work for others will work on the LE (depending, of course, on the specific mod), but people who are buying a 4R and adding $10k or more in new gear also like a lower price point, so most of these builds don't start with the LE.
     
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  7. Aug 10, 2019 at 11:13 AM
    #7
    RedRunner87

    RedRunner87 Mall Crawler LVL Expert

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    My take on it: They are more expensive out of the box.They also have a different front bumper, so you can't do the low pro style bumpers on them. I think most people like the aggressive look of the non-Limited models. They also come with 20's which aren't very good for off-road.

    The plus side to the Limiteds is the full time 4WD and the plusher interior(if you want those).
     
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  8. Aug 10, 2019 at 2:08 PM
    #8
    redneckj

    redneckj New Member

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    I have heard of this issue with a lifted tacoma but I’ve never read or heard of this issue on a 4Runner. It must be pretty rare.
     
  9. Aug 10, 2019 at 4:11 PM
    #9
    Thatbassguy

    Thatbassguy New Member

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    Welcome to the forum!

    I agree with the other replies. The limited will probably be fine for most off-roading. Even with the 20" wheels, you can probably get tires more suitable for mud, gravel, ETC.

    Buy what you want, and customize it to suit your needs.

    :cheers:
     
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  10. Aug 10, 2019 at 10:13 PM
    #10
    elkin

    elkin [OP] New Member

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    Wow, lots of helpful replies, thank you very much.

    As a newbie, a clarification I'd like to ask about:

    What are ATs? All Terrain tires? And also (this will really prove how clueless I am), the difference between 20s and 17s, that has less to do with the tire diameter itself and more to do with the center/hubcap area? The tires on the Limited aren't nearly as nice/rugged as the ones on the other models. Would swapping out the stock Limited tires for the tires on the Pro be a good idea? I don't need a lift to do that, right? Are there any benefits to 20 over 17?

    Basically, I want the interior of the Limited with the rugged looks/height/tires of the Pro. As others mentioned, it's a shame there isn't a 4Runner that has everything maxed out out of the box, though I'm not sure how big of an audience a model like that would have.

    I won't be doing any insane offroading like you see in jeep and 4runner youtube videos, no rock crawling or anything. The most intense thing I'd use it for is some slightly uneven/rugged gravel roads (logging roads up the steep mountain sides in remote areas of Oregon). I'm assuming the Limited should be capable enough to handle that, though I think swapping out the stock tires for the TRD Pro tires would be a good idea.

    Are there any downsides to having TRD/Pro tires on a Limited if I'm driving around the city? Do those tires add road noise or anything like that?

    Again, sorry for the annoying/amateur questions.
     
  11. Aug 10, 2019 at 11:33 PM
    #11
    Thatbassguy

    Thatbassguy New Member

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    A shorter sidewall (20" rim) will flex less, and probably feel more planted on pavement. Other than that, some people prefer the look.

    A taller sidewall (17" rim) will flex more and probably contributes to the mushy steering feel that some reviews complain about.

    But, that extra sidewall becomes useful when you get off road and air down the tires. It allows the tire to spread out and float over soft terrain, like sand.

    Also, most all terrain tires have a little road noise. Some are worse than others. Generally, they'll be louder than all season tires, but they're much better than they used to be.
     
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  12. Aug 11, 2019 at 2:31 AM
    #12
    MeefZah

    MeefZah Curmudgeonly

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    Things with stuff, but nothing much
    It's not rare at all; my 2014 TE with a 2.5" lift had it. However, the guy who posted about it is overstating it. You don't need to replace the needle bearings if you do a lift. And, if it fails, you don't get a "wobbly" feeling.

    Lift it, if (eventually) this causes the needle bearings to fail you will know as there is a rumbling / growling / light vibration on that side of the diff at moderate speeds in 2wd; the sound / vibration goes away in 4wd. If it happens, you fix it with the ECGS bushing. No big deal.
     
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  13. Aug 11, 2019 at 4:46 AM
    #13
    Toffees

    Toffees New Member

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    Yep, basically what thatbassguy said. You can get more aggressive tires on your 20s, but they will have thin sidewalls and will feel more jarring off road. There has been some concern about wheel width and tires on the 20s, but most people are still able to fit ATs even if the selection is less. You can swap any 4R wheel, they’ll all fit. And there are plenty of aftermarket wheels that fit also, but you need to consider backspacing and I don’t really understand that math.
     
  14. Aug 11, 2019 at 5:05 AM
    #14
    2016Pro

    2016Pro Why all of the Pro hate?

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    As mentioned the limited is the grocery wagon model. The trd pro is the top of the line offroad model. Most of the forum members tend to prefer some offroad capabilities on their 4runners.
     
  15. Aug 11, 2019 at 5:09 AM
    #15
    Braves95

    Braves95 New Member

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    Yes you DO NOT need to do it. But while you have it apart might as well do it. The cost of doing it while it's already up and things are ripped apart, over pulling it apart again? I would just include it and in there once and done.
     
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  16. Aug 11, 2019 at 5:09 AM
    #16
    Toffees

    Toffees New Member

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    This made me laugh
     
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  17. Aug 11, 2019 at 5:11 AM
    #17
    elkin

    elkin [OP] New Member

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    Thank you all for the info about the wheels and pros/cons.

    Aside from the wheels and lower ground clearance, what else about the Limited make it... limited I guess? It's still capable of offroading more than most other SUVs, right? Again, not talking rock crawling or anything extreme, just taking it off the beaten path, gravel roads, dirt roads, driving up mountain roads, etc. I'm guessing these tasks won't be an issue in any 4runner, including the Limited?

    Again, thanks for all the replies, you've really helped me out.
     
  18. Aug 11, 2019 at 5:11 AM
    #18
    Braves95

    Braves95 New Member

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    Yeah aren't they all offroad capable? Maybe not rock crawling capable.

    Why get the pro for 10k more? Get off road premium and add the pro stuff ie: kings skids sliders and still come out ahead.
    Yes I know pro has fox.
     
  19. Aug 11, 2019 at 5:13 AM
    #19
    Braves95

    Braves95 New Member

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    The ground clearance I believe them same other than the pro off the lot. But save money and add what you want.
     
  20. Aug 11, 2019 at 5:13 AM
    #20
    elkin

    elkin [OP] New Member

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    I'm not sure really. I mostly want the upgraded interior of the Limited, with the height/tires/etc of the Pro. Would it be best to get the Pro and then go for aftermarket leather seats? Or go with the Limited and get it lifted + new wheels, etc?
     
  21. Aug 11, 2019 at 5:13 AM
    #21
    Agent_Outside

    Agent_Outside New Member

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    Me to
     
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  22. Aug 11, 2019 at 5:17 AM
    #22
    Braves95

    Braves95 New Member

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    What is the price difference between the regular limited (not the nightshade)? If you go kings it will be around 2500. With the click adjusters. Tires and rims I would say another 2k. 4500. Labor and alignment? Depending if you want new upper control arms to get better caster 700.00 JBA.
     
  23. Aug 11, 2019 at 5:21 AM
    #23
    Toffees

    Toffees New Member

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    One man’s opinion; get what you like and test drive as many as you can.

    If you want to the best out of the box setup, get a Trail/Off Road

    If you want a good base for heavy wheeling modding, get the SR5

    If you want one that looks the coolest, get the Pro*

    If you want AWD, or the creature comforts, get the LE

    The *only* exclusive features (outside of ventilated seats, etc) on the models are rear locker, Kdss or xreas, center locker, and crawl control. *i forgot the new Pros come with a fox setup. That’s a nice starting point.

    99% of 4R drivers can’t out perform a stock 4x4 platform. Find the one you want, enjoy it, and post up some pics so we can enjoy your ride as well.
     
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  24. Aug 11, 2019 at 5:27 AM
    #24
    Toffees

    Toffees New Member

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    Nightshade is probably toughest to match wheels I’d imagine. It’s relatively easy to find somebody ditching their OR wheels if you want to add cheap 17s to a regular LE. And imo they look good on the LE.
     
  25. Aug 11, 2019 at 5:36 AM
    #25
    elkin

    elkin [OP] New Member

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    Thank you very much, this kind of general breakdown is exactly what I was hoping to come across. I'm thinking based on everything said here, my test drives and relentless googling that the Nightshade (which I believe is just the Limited but with most things accented in black) is the option I'm going to spring for. It seems to be capable of what I need in terms of gravel roads heading up the mountains and, of course, all the bells and whistles I need for city driving.

    Now just waiting for my dealership to get them in. They haven't heard an exact date though they said they'd call me on Monday or Tuesday with more info. Anyone have any idea when the 2020 4runners are due to hit dealerships?

    (And yes, once I purchase I'll post up some photos!)
     
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  26. Aug 11, 2019 at 5:39 AM
    #26
    Toffees

    Toffees New Member

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    Since you're looking at all of these and are also interested in lifts, make sure you read up on XREAS (all LE models) and KDSS (some TRDOR models), each of these provides suspension benefits but also makes lifting more difficult (or must be removed to lift). Neither kills lifting, but it is a little silly to pay for features you'll rip off if you lift.
     
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  27. Aug 11, 2019 at 5:43 AM
    #27
    elkin

    elkin [OP] New Member

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    Thank you for this post. One of the things that has made this process a bit difficult is the fact that three different salesman at my local Toyota dealership (Toyota of Portland) that I've spoken to don't seem too knowledgable. I've managed to get out of them that each one of them is a new hire (one 2 weeks, the other two have been there a month). They often have to look up on their computer anytime I ask a question, which doesn't do much for my confidence. Hence I end up here asking you all. Some questions I just cannot get an answer to, even Googling. Such as, what is the height difference between the Pro and the Limited - it's a question I've asked several people at the dealership and none can give me a solid answer. I may not need a lift if I can find out how much clearance the Limited has vs the Pro.
     
  28. Aug 11, 2019 at 6:06 AM
    #28
    KSJ08

    KSJ08 New Member

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    Well you are doing proper research, because like you stated salesmen do NOT know their own product!! Buy what you like and will perform the way YOU will use it! I personnally do not like leather seats. My wife's current & last 3 cars had them and this Acura has push button start, not for ME. She loves it and it's HER car. She does love the 4Runner, Hated the Tacoma A/C TRD Sport, liked the FJ's (Fake Ass Hood Scope:stirthepot::D) and all. I lke the agressive look/features of the TRD ORP, Again it's YOUR decision get what YOU want unless someone else is buying it for you then THEY can tel you what you're getting :p:hattip:.
     
  29. Aug 11, 2019 at 6:11 AM
    #29
    elkin

    elkin [OP] New Member

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    Thank you. Yep, my own money, my own decision. I personally like leather seats, I find the faux leather stuff in the other models to feel a little odd, almost sticky and stretchy? Do you prefer that material over actual leather?

    And yeah, very disappointing the salesmen seem to uneducated on the vehicles they're selling. I understand, they're new, but still...

    I also like the push start button. Why don't you like that? Seems like just another convenience feature. Are the Limited/Nightshade the only models with push start?
     
  30. Aug 11, 2019 at 6:21 AM
    #30
    KSJ08

    KSJ08 New Member

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    Yes I personally like fabricate over Leather, summer time they're wicked HOT & winter wicked cold until heater kicks in.

    Yes they maybe new BUT the manager SHOULD at least get them farmiliarize them with the products.

    If you don't have FOB it's a PITA for ME, just old fashion on this item I guess. I do not know what the other models will do W/push button start. I'm sure in the future as I trad I will have to own one eventually:annoyed::frustrated::D
     

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