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Researched bigger tires+lift, but now maybe just stock size upgrade?

Discussion in '5th Gen 4Runners (2010+)' started by kaitlyn2004, Oct 16, 2020.

  1. Oct 16, 2020 at 9:05 PM
    #1
    kaitlyn2004

    kaitlyn2004 [OP] New Member

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    I've got a 2020 4Runner TRD off-road w/ KDSS & Dunlop AT and about 11,000km (6800 miles) and I feel like my mind has been racing all over the place...

    Upgrading to tires, larger size
    Looking at lift/suspension options

    And now I'm thinking I should just replace with 265/70/17 (stock size) Wildpeak A/T3W tires.
    - I was originally thinking 275/70/17, but the wildpeaks seem above-average size and that a rub might be possible (despite trail4runner saying 275's don't rub!)
    - Lift lets me put on bigger/taller tires, but then I'm certainly looking at a BMC, messed up speedo, MAYBE safety sense issues, worse fuel economy... and lift doesn't gie me more ground clearance, only taller tires will (and a fender/rear chop would be an easier and cheaper way to improve angles!)
    - I don't do any "offroading" just hitting gravel and unmaintained roads, but I've been able to get to all the trailheads I've wanted so far (and further than other cars have been able to push)
    - I've not yet aired down tires, but I wonder/worry if when I start airing down my tires if I'll run into any ACTUAL reduced ground clearance issues..
    - Everything I read seems to indicate people want to be putting on the larger tires/largest they can get away with because of the benefits (despite some cons listed above) but obviously people are upgrading and keeping stock tire size?
    - Save money from larger+heavier tires, lift, possible BMC and put that towards other things I can DEFINITELY use more immediately?
    - I guess going this way doesn't preclude me from doing diff tires/chop/lift later on... maybe when stock suspension is more worn, when I don't worry as much about chopping "brand new" car, etc. etc...?


    Any reason I should reconsider my latest idea of just replacing stock size with a better AT winter-rated tire?
     
  2. Oct 16, 2020 at 9:14 PM
    #2
    Mtbpsych

    Mtbpsych New Member

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    Replace the stock tires with some all terrains and call it a day.
     
  3. Oct 16, 2020 at 9:16 PM
    #3
    kaitlyn2004

    kaitlyn2004 [OP] New Member

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    So unless I start rethinking the wildpeaks or some other tire, that's exactly where I'm at. At least it would save me my sanity! :)
     
  4. Oct 17, 2020 at 3:41 AM
    #4
    ThePnsh3r

    ThePnsh3r New Member

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    I’ve lifted mine and installed BFG KO2s 285 in C load and had zero issues with rubbing and have done absolutely zero trimming or fender liner mod even. Truck has been on a couple of trails already and had zero rub.
    A lot of it comes to wheel offset, and proper lift with UCAs. Also, KO2 run a bit smaller compared to some other brands. Could not be happier with my setup.

    A81CA177-9827-471E-8545-4824D3A57EDA.jpg
     
  5. Oct 17, 2020 at 3:46 AM
    #5
    jvinhj240

    jvinhj240 New Member

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    what lift do you have? front and rear?
     
  6. Oct 17, 2020 at 4:06 AM
    #6
    ThePnsh3r

    ThePnsh3r New Member

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    I went with the Ironman Foam Cell Pro stage 2. It’s a complete kit.

    FEA4C4A9-7B6A-4426-BD33-56783B9B0970.jpg
    9DF44EFC-F2BA-44A7-8A42-16FD5093491D.jpg
     
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2020
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  7. Oct 17, 2020 at 4:08 AM
    #7
    ThePnsh3r

    ThePnsh3r New Member

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    You can see the clearances in those photos

    D5D157DF-B5F9-4085-88DC-B11EE655D0B1.jpg
    0DC26367-E8D2-4942-BD99-9BCBBE2801B4.jpg
     
  8. Oct 17, 2020 at 6:38 AM
    #8
    Chris In Milwaukee

    Chris In Milwaukee New Member

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    I went with stock size KO2s and no lift for a while and the vehicle performed admirably. I don’t think you’ll be disappointed with any upgraded tire choice regardless of what you pick. I upgraded suspension because I wanted a ride quality change, but it’s not necessary unless you have a specific performance target. Go for it!

    Before lift:


    After lift:

     
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  9. Oct 17, 2020 at 7:16 AM
    #9
    Snickel Fritz

    Snickel Fritz This member likes turtles.

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    FN Konig Six Shooters+Cooper AT3 4S 255/75/17 Artec Full Aluminum Skidplates Kenwood DNX996XR RAV4 heated blind spot mirrors OEM Blackout Edition LED fogs Buncha sheepskin stuff Not installed... yet: Artec Sliders Hefty Fab Hybrid front bumper Thinkware U1000 DC (benched) Renogy DCC50S (benched)
    Read! Read a LOT.

    I spent 8 months reading before I bought mine, and I'm glad I did.
    Everyone is an ambassador for whatever they've bought- VERY FEW will admit (or maybe even notice) that they bought something that isn't as great as they expected. Looks mean nothing. Search for BAD reviews, and read those.

    My tires have increased my social standing, leveled my blood pressure, and taught me to love again. Buy the same or you're a poser who doesn't 'gram enough.

    Edit;
    I should note that this method of weeding out the junk is actually much faster, because there are in fact several good choices.

    I will go ahead and suggest 255/75/r17 or 255/80/r17, to gain height without rubbing, without losing fuel economy (some claim tiny improvements), and improved ride quality/handling/grip in any situation that doesn't require your tire to float, like deep snow or sand.
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2020
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  10. Oct 17, 2020 at 7:24 AM
    #10
    ForRun

    ForRun 4Runner

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    With my 19 I always wanted 285s but settled on 265 and a level. It looked good but every single time I saw 285s on a runner I had regrets.
    My 20, 285s and my only regret now is I didn't do 295s;)
     
  11. Oct 17, 2020 at 8:10 AM
    #11
    glwood54

    glwood54 New Member

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    2019 OR, KDSS, RSG sliders, Eibach struts/shocks, 265/70 Falken Wildpeaks
    You can do it in stages without sacrificing previous parts. For example, I got the Eibach Sport Truck struts & shocks, and somewhat leveled the truck by putting the front strut clips on the second setting (.85 lift). Then I got stock size Wildpeaks. Very happy with the ride & handling. Should I get the desire for more lift & bigger tires, I could complete the Eibach Sport Truck lift by adding the springs, with the option of adding upper control arms. Chances of that are slim in my case, however, but it is a viable option.
     
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  12. Oct 17, 2020 at 8:29 AM
    #12
    akmerle

    akmerle New Member

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    If not doing any real off roading where you need the additional clearance, then 100% just get a new set of more aggressive AT tires.

    Is the rub you are concerned with just fender lining / mud flaps? Or is it the body? Fender lining and mud flaps are easily remedied with a heat gun.
     
  13. Oct 17, 2020 at 10:56 AM
    #13
    nimby

    nimby in the drink

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    Eibach Adj Shocks; 285/70/R17
    I got a pair of Eibach adjustable front struts, set them to 1.6" of lift with the stock coils and put 285's on. Some might want to add a 1" lift coil to the rear, but I didn't need to for my uses.

    Set the caster as high as I could with that lift (3.6*) and did the fender liner mod. I was still able to retain the stock UCA's with this lift height.

    Kept the stock wheel specs so there is no rubbing on the mudflap or body mount. Ride is great. Handling is great on and offroad.

    All in with tires and shocks, I probably spent close to $1,100.
     
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2020
  14. Oct 17, 2020 at 11:27 AM
    #14
    White TuRD

    White TuRD New Member

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    OEM sized C-load KO2 mounted on TRD SEMA rims. The Off-road 4Runners shod be equipped like this from the factory.

    Important to go C-load instead of E-load if you want to maintain rode quality and fuel economy. The naysayers will say the E-load rides fine... they are not bad by any means, but each tire is 5lbs heavier than C-load (~10lb heavier than ORM) and definitely not as nice road handling for daily driving.
     
  15. Oct 17, 2020 at 5:17 PM
    #15
    kaitlyn2004

    kaitlyn2004 [OP] New Member

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    Hmm wouldn't the 255/70/17 actually give me LESS height? The wildpeaks, at least, don't seem to come in a 255/75/17


    Yeah, and I guess this is sort of where I'm heading. Tires first and see from there - while not the end of the world, if I wanted to do upgrades before the tire end-of-life, then it's a bit of "wasted" or lost money. But yeah I feel now more than ever I'll at the very least hold off on the lift - so then it becomes 265 or trying for 275 tires... or just quit thinking and stay stock size (265)

    I mean, rubbing in general is what I'm worried about. I'd certainly be much more worried about body rubbing. The 275/70/17 wildpeak a/t3w's on stock suspension and wheels, I can't quite nail down from anywhere where or how much these rub. And I don't know if it's even worth this debate of 275 vs 265 stock size... :S
     
  16. Oct 17, 2020 at 5:31 PM
    #16
    nimby

    nimby in the drink

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    Eibach Adj Shocks; 285/70/R17
    If you're using the stock OR wheels and 275's, you should be able to make them fit without rubbing. You might have to work with an alignment shop so they can dial in your caster (I would guess somewhere around +3.2 degrees would be the sweet spot, but that's a guess).
     
  17. Oct 17, 2020 at 5:38 PM
    #17
    kaitlyn2004

    kaitlyn2004 [OP] New Member

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    Is it even worth the debate 265 or 275? Any improvement in the 275... is it actually gonna be noticeable/measurable? Or just stick to 265 and call it a day?
     
  18. Oct 17, 2020 at 5:40 PM
    #18
    nimby

    nimby in the drink

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    Eibach Adj Shocks; 285/70/R17
    I'm actually a fan of 285's on our trucks, so don't ask me.
     
  19. Oct 17, 2020 at 5:50 PM
    #19
    Snickel Fritz

    Snickel Fritz This member likes turtles.

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    Oops again! That's 255/75/r17 & 255/80/r17... sorry!
     
  20. Oct 17, 2020 at 5:50 PM
    #20
    fajitas21

    fajitas21 New Member

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    @kaitlyn2004 I had a 2016 Trail Premium (Same as offroad premium) with Bilstein 2.5" lift, and ran the 265/70/r17 (Falken Wildpeak AT/3 Load E, then Nitto Terra Grappler G2 P metric) for 3 years. On the 4th year I went 285/70/17 (BFG KO2 C Load). MPG didn't really change. Truck didn't feel more or less sluggish. I went wheeling with them, kinda felt the same. I could do it all on 265, then the 285 did it without really feeling like I was doing any better or worse. It was like a .5" more lift, so it's really not noticeable. Speedo was a little off (or rather, accurate finally.....).

    I bought a 2020 OR Premium. Went back to 265/70/17, so much easier to deal with, and with the lift, no rubbing at all.

    So I guess I'm in the camp of when I had a new truck, I just went back to 265/70/17 and am very pleased. Simple is best. You got all the time in the world to make the truck worse, but it's a lot hard to reverse some of those lifts, BMCs, and cap mount chops. Take your time. As someone who's offroading a good bit, the people on 32" and 33" do the same. The people on stock height vs 2" lifts do see a difference. Technically ground clearance will only come with tires, but with in IFS you do get additional clearance up front with a lift, and you get that stupid gas tank off the ground with a lift. The only thing that doesn't lift is the pumpkin, so straddle rocks to the middle left or middle right.

    Either way, stock height, lift, 265 vs 285, this thing gets about the same MPG depending on how you drive. Also, it's about as capable. However, more aggressive tires doesn't hurt anything in the stock size, and that one thing makes the truck look completely different. More than any single other mod, it's the best for offroading for traction, and it's the best way to change the look.
     
  21. Oct 18, 2020 at 12:00 PM
    #21
    Oldtoyotaguy

    Oldtoyotaguy Not a new member

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    I run a stock size K02 for all the reasons you mention, kaitlyn2004. Once you’ve got clearance issues on pavement, imagine what that’s going to be like off road. A good AT tire will look good. Lots of guys ask me what size are your tires?, lol. I did upgrade the suspension, for other reasons. I gained 1 1/2” and a lot more performance on and off road. In my experience, Toyota trucks look great with a modest lift too. A little more rugged and cool. So many choices with a blank slate! Good luck, kaitlyn2004.
     
  22. Oct 18, 2020 at 12:35 PM
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    nightflyer

    nightflyer New Member

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    I have stock size KO2’s on stock suspension and have been pleased so far. I did some off-roading in Colorado last month with no issues. 4576F69E-C922-4603-AD08-B94BBD5E37F6.jpg
     
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  23. Oct 18, 2020 at 12:39 PM
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    ham4run

    ham4run New Member

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    I went through a very similar thought process as you OP. I ended up with stock size Toyo AT3’s. They ride the same as the stock Dunlop’s, but obviously much more tread for off road purposes. I plan on a suspension upgrade later on, but two things I weighed out. Knowing having better tires would be better, but waiting on a lift, 265’s were guaranteed to not rub or change speedo readout or anything else. When a suspension upgrade does happen, I don’t think 265’s look bad on the lift I plan on getting so I’m happy all around.
     
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  24. Oct 18, 2020 at 3:43 PM
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    Oldtoyotaguy

    Oldtoyotaguy Not a new member

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    K02s always look great, stock size or whatever. 265s look perfect on a modest lift. There’s nothing wrong with lots of clearance off road. I waited almost a year and a half before I changed out the suspension on mine. It was a big decision, lol. If you search ELKA there’s a thread on it. BTW, nightflyer, where was that photo taken, it looks like a cool trail.
     
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2020
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  25. Oct 18, 2020 at 4:00 PM
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    Chris In Milwaukee

    Chris In Milwaukee New Member

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    I appreciate my Dobinsons lift, but would have loved to know about ELKA so I could have added it to my comparisons list. I’m glad you like yours!
     
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  26. Oct 18, 2020 at 4:04 PM
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    Oldtoyotaguy

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    I hear Dobinsons are great too. Thanks, Chris in Milwaukee.
     
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  27. Oct 18, 2020 at 6:04 PM
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    nightflyer

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    It was taken on the Cinnamon Pass section of the Alpine Loop in Colorado. The trail was pretty easy overall but did have a couple sections where I needed to be careful with my line. It was a piece of cake for a stock 4Runner though.
     
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  28. Oct 18, 2020 at 7:33 PM
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    kaitlyn2004

    kaitlyn2004 [OP] New Member

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    I certainly know the KO2s... they seem like a super popular option. BUT they seem to be known for both being noisy AND poor wet performance? Living on the west coast, I deal with driving in PLENTY of rain and wet snow
     
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  29. Oct 18, 2020 at 7:50 PM
    #29
    Oldtoyotaguy

    Oldtoyotaguy Not a new member

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    Mine are quiet. Alignment is everything to avoid noisy tires. Off road vehicles get bumped around, and if you’re not religious about alignments, your tires will get almost invisible cups in them making them noisy. I get it, no one wants to spend money on something you can’t see, but it’s false economy. As for wet performance, you hear all kinds of anecdotal comments from folks based on unscientific methodology - “I almost spun out on a wet road, it must have been my tires!” Lol. If there is a scientific result which establishes K02 inferiority on wet roads, I’ll eat my hat, lol. They are snow rated, however for cold winter driving, I change them out to a true winter tire for the icy roads where I live.
     
  30. Oct 18, 2020 at 7:56 PM
    #30
    kaitlyn2004

    kaitlyn2004 [OP] New Member

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    Yeah, the endless anecdotal "evidence" or recos based on entirely different places/scenarios/habits is... difficult for someone new to all this!

    I think maybe I just need to bite the bullet, virtually any option should be an upgrade over the stock dunlops on every terrain...

    I am planning to ride mine year-round, though.
     
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