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new to the yota world need advice

Discussion in '1st Gen 4Runners (1984-1989)' started by jiggie, Dec 14, 2014.

  1. Dec 14, 2014 at 4:00 PM
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    jiggie

    jiggie [OP] New Member

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    Hey all!! So I've been reading searching and have some questions that I can't find or have missed the answered too. So please don't hate me too bad if you have the answers to the questions and I missed it..this is all for a stock base 86 runner.


    First, my quarters are rusted pretty good, but I don't want to replace them cause that money can go to other parts. What's the best way to fix and stop the rust that will cost the least?

    Second, my runner seems to be a extremely slow..I've done all the basic mantaince plugs wires etc. It's stock hight with stock size tires in fact it's completely stock. Is this normal Or Should I do a turbo add on just for the extra get up and go?

    And last I'm staying ifs and this will be a daily work driver and weekend wheeler. Should I invest in lockers or just stay open open with maybe a super low range t case rebuild?

    Thanks for the input. Hopefully this pic uploads
     
  2. Dec 14, 2014 at 4:02 PM
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    wnelax04sr5

    wnelax04sr5 Moderator Staff Member

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  3. Dec 14, 2014 at 5:28 PM
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    Bob

    Bob Member Staff Member

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    Utah likes this.
  4. Dec 14, 2014 at 6:08 PM
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    wnelax04sr5

    wnelax04sr5 Moderator Staff Member

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    I just don't remember quite like you do....must be the admin super powers
     
  5. Dec 15, 2014 at 5:00 AM
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    Utah

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    Somebody rang?

    Ok, from top to bottom - first, define "pretty good", because I can't see your pic. If it's surface rust, just clean it up. If the sheet metal is rotten with holes in it, you've got three options - remove the entire quarterpanel and replace it with fiberglass (spendy), cut out the rusted sections and patch them with sheet metal from a donor truck (labor intensive), or accept that it's a thirty year old truck and ignore it until you can afford to fix it right. That's what I'm doing with my current truck.

    Second - yeah, they're slow. The 22RE made all of 112 HP when it came off the factory line, it was never a race car to start with. If you've got the base model, I'm guessing it's an auto, which makes matters worse. Past the basic tuneup items there are a few things you can do about it. First, check your compression - if the motor is tired, brand new spark plugs aren't going to help, but a rebuild will. It won't cost too much either, if you do the work yourself. If the compression is good, then you're probably getting all you're going to get in stock form, so it's time to play. The cheapest bump is to push your timing. The stock setting is -5BTDC, but you can push it to -10 or -12 and get a little kick in the pants that way. Don't push the advance so hard the motor pings when you get in the throttle - if you hear pinging, back off the timing advance. The next cheapest bump is going to be a nice cam. www.engnbldr.com makes a great torquey little cam that's basically a drop-in mod, and that's also good for a slight increase in useable power. If you still have money to burn, a long tube exhaust header will give a noticeable boost too. After that, you're talking real money - chambered cylinder head with oversize valves, ported throttle body, stroker pistons, turbo or supercharger, you can easily drop five to ten grand on that motor and never break 200hp and lose all the stock reliability of the 22RE in the process. At the end of the day, it's still just a little 2.4l 4cyl truck motor, and the benefit to cost ratio gets really ugly really quick. If you want useable power, I'd skip the mods and look into an engine swap. That's what I'm doing. Another option is to fiddle with your diff gearing... stock five speed gears are 4.10, the auto gets 4.30, you could swap your 4.10s for 4.30 or swap your 4.30 with 4.56s (some 2nd gen 4Runners have 4.56 gears, and the diffs will bolt up to your truck). Your RPM would be a little higher at a given speed making your mileage drop slightly, but you'd notice a big difference in usable power. If you do have an auto, you can also look into a swap to a five speed. The A340f automatic trans is crazy reliable, but it's also the picture you see when you look up "slushbox" in the dictionary. It's a terrible, horrible, no good, very bad transmission, and I loath it with the burning fiery loathing of a thousand suns of fiery burning loathing. The W56 five speed is so much better in every respect. The swap isn't easy, but it's worth it and takes a truck from "worthless slug" to "fun to drive". I recommend it highly.

    Third, offroad mods. Tough call between a locker or tcase gears, both are very useful. If you're an automatic, I think a Spartan or Aussie locker will give you the best bang for your buck, they're $250 or so on Rockauto and you drop 'em in and you're good. If you have a five speed, think about 4.7 gears in the transfer case. For one, it's cheaper because you don't need an adapter, and two, wheeling a manual with stock tcase gears can lead to frequent clutch replacement, and that's a PITA. Dunno where you are, but around here if you watch the classifieds you can find a used 4.7 case for around $400, which is cheaper than the gears cost new and saves you the effort to install, which can suck if you don't have a press and a dial gauge and know how to use them. Having said all that, I wouldn't do either right away. I'd invest in a set of skids and sliders and wheel it stock while you build some skill - add mods too early and they turn into a crutch and keep you from getting better, IMO.

    Is that a big enough info dump? Should get you started anyway. I'd ignore the rust, leave the motor stockish, swap to a five speed (if you have the auto), maybe look into swapping diffs, and wheel the piss out of it for a while until you decide what offroad mods you need. Good luck, and let us know what you decide.
     
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2014
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  6. Dec 15, 2014 at 5:04 AM
    #6
    Utah

    Utah Misanthrope

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    He forgot @BestGen though. So much for super powers...
     
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  7. Dec 15, 2014 at 7:59 AM
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    BestGen

    BestGen Huge Member

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    1988 4Runner 22RE/W56, 4.88s, Spartan Locker, AllPro Sliders, BFG 33/10.5s, 4Crawler 1.5" BJS, OME 2" Dakar springs
    33"KM2s, 4.88s, Spartan lkr, TG rear bumper, AllPro Kickout sliders, 4Crawler 1.5" BJS, OME 2" Dakar springs.
    That was quite the dump...

    And a lot of info too!!! :rimshot:
     
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  8. Dec 15, 2014 at 8:11 AM
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    BestGen

    BestGen Huge Member

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    33"KM2s, 4.88s, Spartan lkr, TG rear bumper, AllPro Kickout sliders, 4Crawler 1.5" BJS, OME 2" Dakar springs.
    This will help u determine what gears u have(unless somebody changed 'em). The tag is on the firewall on the drivers side for 1st Gens. On 2nd Gens its in the drivers door jam when your at the pick-a-part. image.jpg
     
  9. Dec 15, 2014 at 10:03 AM
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    jiggie

    jiggie [OP] New Member

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    Wow thanks!!! Starting top to bottom , yes the quarters are rusted through so I'll just wait till I can replace them. I'll invest in the anti rust paint and bed liner for now lol.

    It's actually a manual, and since I work at a dealership that sells toytoas I got her in today and my lack of go seems to be caused by a stuck parking brake. So now I need rear brake work lol. Engine is good got the timing set to the -10( guess the Tech knew about that lol) and he said it should be fine now. I will be doing the headers since the exhaust is first on the list of things to fix coughing* lol.

    Since the rear end does need rebuilt (major drive line play) I'll proly just stick with the stock gearing but add a locker or limited slipas you mentioned .

    And yes I feel like I'm learning to wheel all over again. I'm from the jeep world and it seems to be much different in a yoga then a jeep so lots of practice.

    Thanks for all the info and I'll let you guys know what happens!!!!
     
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  10. Dec 15, 2014 at 10:34 AM
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    jiggie

    jiggie [OP] New Member

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    Any good links for Rear ends? Other that the one above?
     
  11. Dec 15, 2014 at 3:18 PM
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    Ol'Blue

    Ol'Blue Moderator Staff Member

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    A few things here and there. Still dreaming up stuff
  12. Dec 15, 2014 at 3:55 PM
    #12
    jiggie

    jiggie [OP] New Member

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    I've settled on the Aussie lockers for the front an rear. Seem to be the best idea for what I plan on using the 4runner for
     
  13. Dec 15, 2014 at 6:55 PM
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    BestGen

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    1988 4Runner 22RE/W56, 4.88s, Spartan Locker, AllPro Sliders, BFG 33/10.5s, 4Crawler 1.5" BJS, OME 2" Dakar springs
    33"KM2s, 4.88s, Spartan lkr, TG rear bumper, AllPro Kickout sliders, 4Crawler 1.5" BJS, OME 2" Dakar springs.
    image.jpg Haven't heard too much about the Aussie lockers. Went with the Spartan because of the much beefier pins and springs.
     
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2014
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  14. Dec 16, 2014 at 5:20 AM
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    Utah

    Utah Misanthrope

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    x2. I've heard nothing bad about the Aussie, but the Spartan is stronger and cheaper.
     
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  15. Dec 16, 2014 at 11:34 AM
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    YotaDan

    YotaDan New Member

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    I have ran an Aussie Locker for over 6 years. Works awesome! I wheel pretty hard and it has held up. Broke the Carrier once, and last week just broke the Cross Pin, but the locker itself is still going strong.
     
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  16. Dec 16, 2014 at 6:45 PM
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    jiggie

    jiggie [OP] New Member

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    So my dealership wanted to charge me 1500 bucks my cost to rebuild my rear end. The guy I bought it from who also owns a Toyota and a shop said he can do both axles and lift for the same price. So he is going to regear both axles with 4.88's so I can run 35's and still run down the highway and do my 5 inch lift lift all at once. Think he will use the Spartan lockers but not sure. proly won't use 35 inch tires but will for sure go 33's now. The dealership is going to replace the front wheel bearings steering components and hubs for a good price tho lol. Read somewhere about using a different steering box from a land cruiser. Is that correct?
     
  17. Dec 17, 2014 at 12:37 AM
    #17
    Utah

    Utah Misanthrope

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    I don't know anything about Land Cruiser steering boxes, but I've never heard of anyone using one on a 4Runner. Sure you're not thinking of crossover steering? That's a solid axle mod, guys use all sorts of steering boxes for that but mostly the one you've already got, an '86-'95 IFS steering box.
     
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  18. Dec 17, 2014 at 5:18 AM
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    ajohnson

    ajohnson Glamorous

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    Things and stuff and such
    A land cruiser steering box is front swing (pitman arm points to the front) as opposed to pickup and 4Runner IFS rear swinging boxes. It has no benefit for your 4Runner. They are used for SAS to push the axle 4+" forward from stock position.

    4.88's should work great with 33's.
     
  19. Dec 17, 2014 at 9:39 AM
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    jiggie

    jiggie [OP] New Member

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    Ahh ok. I must have been reading something about a sas then when I seen the sttering box mod.
     
  20. Mar 9, 2015 at 4:45 PM
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    Aram

    Aram New Member

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    I got two questions fellers. So I got a auto with 4.30s. I'm trying to do a 2.5 inch OME lift and bj spacers in the front. I wanna run 33x12.50.r15s... First question should I switch over to 4.56s or 4.88s? and second question, should I use wheel spacers?
     
  21. Mar 10, 2015 at 2:08 AM
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    BestGen

    BestGen Huge Member

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    1988 4Runner 22RE/W56, 4.88s, Spartan Locker, AllPro Sliders, BFG 33/10.5s, 4Crawler 1.5" BJS, OME 2" Dakar springs
    33"KM2s, 4.88s, Spartan lkr, TG rear bumper, AllPro Kickout sliders, 4Crawler 1.5" BJS, OME 2" Dakar springs.
    Definitely 4:88s. Maybe even 5:29s since ur running an automatic. Spacers... Not sure, it would depend on the backspacing of the rims you're running and if 33/12.5s rub at all.
     
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2015
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  22. Mar 10, 2015 at 8:31 AM
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    Utah

    Utah Misanthrope

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    5.29, no question, especially if you're planning on 12.5s. In addition to the circumference, that width will add a bunch of weight and rolling resistance over the 10s and 10.5s that smart guys run ;), you'll need all the gearing you can get.

    Spacers, dunno, depends on your wheel width and backspace and the phase of the moon, etc.
     
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  23. Mar 10, 2015 at 12:07 PM
    #23
    Aram

    Aram New Member

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    Thanks guys! Lol Kevin I know its smarter to run the cookie cutters lol, but I just LOVE the look of the 12.50s. I bought a little 5 speed corolla around for gas mileage so I don't have to worry about gas mileage in the runner. As for the wheels, I'm running 3rd gen 4runner wheels. I think the backspacing is 8 inches? I could be wrong though.
     
  24. Mar 10, 2015 at 1:55 PM
    #24
    Utah

    Utah Misanthrope

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    Nowhere near. 3rd gen factory wheels are 16x7 with 4.5 backspacing. I don't know if you'll even get a 12.5 tire on that wheel, and if you do it'll rub like mad.
     
  25. Mar 10, 2015 at 4:08 PM
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    Aram

    Aram New Member

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    Not the factory 16s. I have two sets of rims, 3rd gen 4runner 15 inch wheels, and the classic 15s that came with the 1st gen 4runners stock. Which one would be better suited for 33x12.50R15s?
     
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2015
  26. Mar 11, 2015 at 4:09 AM
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    Utah

    Utah Misanthrope

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    3RZ, OME, 5.29s, 4.7, locked/locked
    Whichever one is wider with more backspace. I don't think either will work for 12.5s, but measure and find out. :)
     
  27. Mar 11, 2015 at 9:18 AM
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    Aram

    Aram New Member

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    They are both 15x7, 6 lug, 5.5 Inch Bolt Pattern, 6 spoke silver alloy wheel. Aint that some sh*t lol. Would the 12.50s fit?
     
  28. Mar 11, 2015 at 12:18 PM
    #28
    Utah

    Utah Misanthrope

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    You're going to have a lot of trouble finding a tire shop to put 12.5 tires on a 7 inch wheel. I don't even know if it's possible.
     
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  29. Mar 11, 2015 at 12:35 PM
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    BestGen

    BestGen Huge Member

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    1988 4Runner 22RE/W56, 4.88s, Spartan Locker, AllPro Sliders, BFG 33/10.5s, 4Crawler 1.5" BJS, OME 2" Dakar springs
    33"KM2s, 4.88s, Spartan lkr, TG rear bumper, AllPro Kickout sliders, 4Crawler 1.5" BJS, OME 2" Dakar springs.
    Technically it's doable, desert racers often do it to protect the bead. But Kevin is right about finding a shop to mount them. Hell I had trouble finding a shop to mount 10.50s on my OEM 15x6 steelies. Which is retarded because they mount 12.50s on 8" wide rims all day. Looks like you'll have to run 10.5s. It's not that bad, I promise!
     
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  30. Mar 11, 2015 at 12:40 PM
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    Aram

    Aram New Member

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    I'm gonna sell my 3 sets of wheels, and get the dick cepek dc-2 rims in 15x8 size. I should be able to fit them on that.
     
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