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Cons to not having KDSS?

Discussion in '5th Gen 4Runners (2010+)' started by Baby_Silverback, Feb 6, 2021.

?

Is this something that should bother me as much as it does.

  1. Yea dude. KDSS is life.

  2. KDSS isn't that big of a deal. You're better off without her.

  3. You're an idiot.

Results are only viewable after voting.
  1. Feb 6, 2021 at 9:26 AM
    #1
    Baby_Silverback

    Baby_Silverback [OP] New Member

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    Hello gang,

    Long time dream came to fruition and I bought my first 4runner. 2021 TRD Off Road Premium. Didn't have a sunroof but I met this concession happily because dealer told me it had KDSS

    .....it does not have KDSS

    I've always been led to believe this is a must for the 4runner as it tames the ride at high speed highway turns and of course some off road low speed benefits. Only time I drive off road is bringing my dirtbike to the trail head or a slightly gnarly lease road on my way to work. I'd of course like to do some overlanding with the girlfriend now that I have a capable (is it still capable?) rig.

    Now I have buyers remorse and I'm looking at my new car like a mother who hates her newborn. I feel utter contempt for it.

    Is not having KDSS an undesirable as I've been led to believe? Are there any silver linings?


    Thank you for your time,

    H
     
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  2. Feb 6, 2021 at 9:33 AM
    #2
    Dark Knight

    Dark Knight Get off my lawn

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    Many positives and negatives for and against kdss. I wouldn’t worry about it and also research/learn about all features before next car purchase.
     
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  3. Feb 6, 2021 at 9:36 AM
    #3
    PVT Pablo

    PVT Pablo Ultra Junior Member

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    In before people pour their heart out about why it's the bees knees or absolutely shit when they've never driven the other one to compare :rolleyes:
     
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  4. Feb 6, 2021 at 9:37 AM
    #4
    rageandlove

    rageandlove New Member

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    I had an older 5th Gen 4Runner w KDSS and in 2019 upgraded that to a Pro which obviously does not have KDSS. I haven't missed it for 1 second, so no, you shouldn't worry about it. Honestly, it's something you don't even notice 99% of the time. Don't worry about it.

    To your question about silver linings. Yes. Go do a web search on KDSS failure and cost to repair. Plenty of horror stories on the various 4Runner forums about the system breaking after a few years, how expensive it is to repair off warrantee, and how many Toyota dealerships don't even have the technical skill to fix the system, etc.

    My KDSS didn't fail in the half-decade I had the truck, but since you wanted a silver lining, there you go ;-)
     
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  5. Feb 6, 2021 at 9:44 AM
    #5
    Cowboy59

    Cowboy59 New Member

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    I can only speak from having KDSS and I really like having it. But there are plenty of folks that don't have KDSS and love their's too. And you can always improve the suspension to improve the ride.

    Never take a salesman's word for granted. I have had salesmen over the years tell me all kinds of things that were not true. Some intentionally so, and some because they really did not know and told me whatever they thought I wanted to hear.

    I specifically requested the KDSS option when I was looking for my 4R. Models with KDSS are not often on dealer lots in FL. I went to four dealers and none had a KDSS equipped 4R. One even told me I only needed it if I was living in the mountains.

    If the dealer told you it had KDSS, I would start with talking to the dealer and share your disappointment. Ask them to replace your vehicle with one that does; or see what options they would be willing to concede to accommodate you. If they are not willing to discuss the matter, I would contact Toyota Corporate and ask for Client Relations. Explain to them what happened and see if they can help. You may not get far, as you have no proof the salesman stated it had KDSS.

    I know in my case, I found the 4R I wanted on the Southeast Toyota docks in Jacksonville, FL. I sent my dealer the stock # and told them if they wanted to sell me a 4R, then I wanted one equipped just like the one I sent them. The next week, they had the very vehicle on their lot for me to come see.

    Unfortunately, the lesson to be learned is always make sure the vehicle meets your expectations before signing the sales agreement.
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2021 at 9:11 PM
  6. Feb 6, 2021 at 9:47 AM
    #6
    ForRun

    ForRun 4Runner

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    I test drove both and on Chicago area harsh roads didn’t notice a difference.
    Stock suspension sucks and there are many options to make it better.
    Rather than losing your shirt on a car swap, go with bilstien or eibach coil overs. For cheaper than a car swap you could get Elka or Kings that perform x times better than kdss
     
  7. Feb 6, 2021 at 9:55 AM
    #7
    Mtbpsych

    Mtbpsych New Member

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    Spend $1000ish on a suspension lift, or just different suspension and you’ll save yourself some bucks and greatly improved the ride quality and handling on/off-road. I’ve never had KDSS, but can imagine it would be nice, BUT my non KDSS 4runner I feel like handled 100000% better after new suspension. If you aren’t doing crazy off road, you aren’t missing much.

    if there’s anything on paper stating what the salesperson told you, and now it obviously isn’t true, I’d contact the dealer.
     
  8. Feb 6, 2021 at 10:07 AM
    #8
    Antman

    Antman New Member

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    I didn’t see the need for kdss. I have a sunroof and have never opened it. Buy new suspension and wheels and tires. It’s a night and day difference.
    But hey if you feel you need those things go take it in and eat a few grand in losses.

    also always get the dealer to give you everything in writing. I.e. email, contract or text. A dealers word of mouth means shit.
     
  9. Feb 6, 2021 at 10:30 AM
    #9
    20AGPro

    20AGPro New Member

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    I second everyone’s opinion here. You’re better off upgrading suspension. The only thing that would concern me is checking the price you paid and window sticker to make sure you didn’t pay extra. As all of us know, most salesmen in those lots don’t have a clue and probably think all OR have that option. Make sure you didn’t pay for it. There are great deals on OR and ORP so just something to check into.
     
  10. Feb 6, 2021 at 10:40 AM
    #10
    PVT Pablo

    PVT Pablo Ultra Junior Member

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    This x1000
     
  11. Feb 6, 2021 at 11:16 AM
    #11
    Thatbassguy

    Thatbassguy New member? Really??

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    @Baby_Silverback I wouldn't worry about it.

    I have KDSS, and I think it's awesome for some people. It can do things that no aftermarket suspension modifications can replicate. Ask anyone here; I am one of the biggest KDSS advocates on this site.

    But, the PRO and SR5 don't offer it, and they're totally badass as well. They have plenty of articulation for most off-roading situations. And, the difference in body roll might not make a difference to you.

    If you are not happy with how your 4runner handles, a good suspension upgrade will do a lot. If you are happy with it, then it doesn't matter.

    I say drive the doors off of it and be happy! With a good set of tires, it is probably capable of more than you'll ever need.

    Congratulations on your purchase, and welcome to the forum!
     
  12. Feb 6, 2021 at 11:18 AM
    #12
    Thatbassguy

    Thatbassguy New member? Really??

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    ^^^^this, too!
     
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  13. Feb 6, 2021 at 11:40 AM
    #13
    Baby_Silverback

    Baby_Silverback [OP] New Member

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    I absolutely appreciate everyone's feedback. I'm sure KDSS is a great feature to have and I'm admittedly a bit butthurt having gone in assuming I had it. As some of you have stated I won't miss what I don't know anyways.

    How this all came about is I finally had the means get a 4runner of my own for reasons you all know (reliability capability, modularity, value retention).

    I found a used 20' TRDORP w/ ADSS for 39.5k

    Shopped around and found this dealer who said they could match that exact same setup in a 21' but different color. 125k bumper to bumper warranty with 33" tires of my choice and synthetic oil changes in a new car for 1k more seemed a steal to me. Sticker was 44k I believe.

    The high arp of the used 20' had a balance higher than the corona low arp 21' with warranty so I assumed no brainer.

    Lesson learned. I will be explicit at every step forevermore.

    Screenshot_20210206-101216_Messages.jpg
    0E5D22D0-.jpg

    0E5D22D0-.jpg
     
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  14. Feb 6, 2021 at 11:50 AM
    #14
    Baby_Silverback

    Baby_Silverback [OP] New Member

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    Forgive my ignorance, I've only driven oem trucks my whole life. Are the Elka or Kings shocks like the fox's that would come on the pro? And what benefits would the bilstein/eibach coil overs give me?

    I'm 100% into upgrading the suspension.

    I have in the shopping cart
    - RCI Rock Sliders
    - C4 low pro with bull bar and light slots
    -Black heritage grill bar because I love the look

    Currently researching
    - Roof Rack (so many cool options. I like the flat models vs the admittedly very cool safari style.)
    -Suspension (please teach me)
    - 285/70 r17 tires and if they will rub stock
    - 17 x 8 - 9 rims (Are FN FX Pro's legit or cheap knock off? Are the hub centric?) (I love them)
     
  15. Feb 6, 2021 at 11:53 AM
    #15
    Baby_Silverback

    Baby_Silverback [OP] New Member

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    Thank you for the warm welcome. I look forward to contributing in the future.
     
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  16. Feb 6, 2021 at 11:59 AM
    #16
    20AGPro

    20AGPro New Member

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    No. The fox shocks that come on the Pro are really nice but you can get better. It really depends on what you want to spend and your ride preference. The fox shocks aren’t cheap but cheaper than Elka and King. Fox usually offer a softer ride as well which some like and some don’t. Depends on what you want to spend and your needs I would think fox or bilstein would offer quiet an upgrade on your ride comfort and be all you would need. King are the cats ass. If you can afford it and want them then go for it. I don’t know a lot about elka but i know they’re good and they’re high!
     
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  17. Feb 6, 2021 at 12:03 PM
    #17
    Moon Landing

    Moon Landing AFFTC 1967/68 Eddies Air Patch

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    Hunter,

    You'll be in love with your new truck by tonight if you accept the life lesson learned. Who know's where or when, but my best guess is this life lesson will serve you well for years and years to come.

    You have a beautiful truck! It will serve you well for years and years, KDSS, or Not.

    Congrats! Enjoy your new ride.

    ML
     
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  18. Feb 6, 2021 at 12:04 PM
    #18
    mve

    mve New Member

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    I specifically searched for and got ORP without KDSS.
     
  19. Feb 6, 2021 at 12:04 PM
    #19
    20AGPro

    20AGPro New Member

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    Also when you get into set ups like King, you get into the ability to adjust the stiffness for on/off road situations. Set ups like the fox that come on the Pro have whats called a piggy back reservoir that as it heats up from use it alters the stiffness kind of automatically. Unless you have money to burn, need them for a lot of off roading or just want them, King would be overkill.
     
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  20. Feb 6, 2021 at 12:05 PM
    #20
    20AGPro

    20AGPro New Member

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    And this! My buddy did the same. While KDSS seems to be great, it’s not going to make or break a 4R being awesome! A lot seek out OR without KDSS. You still got an amazing SUV
     
  21. Feb 6, 2021 at 12:16 PM
    #21
    Thatbassguy

    Thatbassguy New member? Really??

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    This comment doesn't really make sense as KDSS has nothing to do with the shocks.
     
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  22. Feb 6, 2021 at 12:22 PM
    #22
    Thatbassguy

    Thatbassguy New member? Really??

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    Like @20AGPro mentioned, King and Elka are similar to Fox. You can get an aftermarket Fox setup with more features than the PRO setup as well. Radflo is another less well known brand that's worth looking at for an upgrade.

    If I were starting from scratch, I would do all of the mods that add weight first. Then, I would work with a suspension tuner like @AccuTune Offroad and get shocks built specifically for my vehicle's running weight and my intended use.
     
  23. Feb 6, 2021 at 12:33 PM
    #23
    Baby_Silverback

    Baby_Silverback [OP] New Member

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    That sounds like wisdom right there.

    What are the major weight contributors that I am forgetting?

    - RCI Rock Sliders
    - C4 low pro with bull bar (and wench)
    - Roof Rack and Ladder
    - New Tires (Do you know if 285/70 r17 fit?)

    I would like to order everything within reason and get it on the way.
     
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  24. Feb 6, 2021 at 12:36 PM
    #24
    Baby_Silverback

    Baby_Silverback [OP] New Member

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    My intended use if towing my dirtbike, lover, and two dogs all over Texas (homebase), Moab (favorite riding), Colorado (close), and anywhere else my heart takes me. I want to start setting up for long haul trail excursions. That just seems so fun to get into. 4runners and jeeps all over Moab have made me want to join this community for years.
     
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  25. Feb 6, 2021 at 12:42 PM
    #25
    Thatbassguy

    Thatbassguy New member? Really??

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    Lol, I think you mean winch. :D

    Skids, if you're planning on them. If you're going to play in the rocks, you'll want them.

    I also lug around about 100+ LBS of tools and recovery gear pretty much at all times.

    285's usually require an alignment for maximum caster, and a bit of trimming.
     
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  26. Feb 6, 2021 at 12:46 PM
    #26
    Baby_Silverback

    Baby_Silverback [OP] New Member

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    You're right, I shouldn't talk about her like that.
     
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  27. Feb 6, 2021 at 12:54 PM
    #27
    ToyotaMacGyver

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    From what I have gathered KDSS will fail at some point and not be worth the expense to fix since the whole system will need replaced.

    Also from what I have gathered you can’t lift 3” with KDSS.

    I haven’t driven a runner with KDSS, but from what I gather you won’t be missing it. I do agree that you should try to work something out with the dealer and get you into one that has it if you want it. I hate dealing with salesman for this reason: they will tell you anything you want to hear.
     
  28. Feb 6, 2021 at 1:09 PM
    #28
    Thatbassguy

    Thatbassguy New member? Really??

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    A lot of folks have KDSS and I've only heard of a handful of failures. I'm not sure why the whole system would need replacement if only one part failed. Are you sure you're not thinking of XREAS?

    There are some who have lifted 3" with no problem. Plus, 3" is generally overkill, especially in back.
     
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  29. Feb 6, 2021 at 2:25 PM
    #29
    ForRun

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    So I did test drive on crappy roads each and noticed no difference so I bought one without. Going off what I’ve read KDSS helps stabilize ride comfort and keep the rig planted. Since good coil overs due the same thing perhaps I misunderstood?
     
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  30. Feb 6, 2021 at 2:33 PM
    #30
    Thatbassguy

    Thatbassguy New member? Really??

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    You are correct in that it does reduce lean in cornering. It's not intended to help with overall ride comfort the way a suspension upgrade would, though.

    But, the other part is that it behaves like a sway bar disconnect in off camber situations. That's the part that makes it really cool.

    Again, I don't think it should be a deal breaker for anyone. I just think it's really nice for those who want a good combination of road manners and better articulation in off-road situations.
     
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