1. Welcome to 4Runners.com!

    You are currently viewing as a guest! To get full-access, you need to register for a FREE account.

    As a registered member, you’ll be able to:
    • Participate in all 4Runner discussion topics
    • Transfer over your build thread from a different forum to this one
    • Communicate privately with other 4Runner owners from around the world
    • Post your own photos in our Members Gallery
    • Access all special features of the site

Best way to lift or level kdss system??

Discussion in 'Suspension' started by trail16whitebeast, Jan 5, 2017.

  1. Jan 17, 2020 at 3:46 PM
    #31
    4X4Runner

    4X4Runner The Anti Pro, Pro! Staff Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2014
    Member:
    #2
    Messages:
    1,533
    Gender:
    Male
    The left coast
    Vehicle:
    2017 4Runner Smashed Ass Edition
    Mad driver mod. OME Suspension. 285/70R17 BFG AT KO2
    Also factor in that when Offroad and a wheel dips into the terrain it’s applying hydraulic force to the opposing stabilizer bar and the force affects the stabilizers travel.
     
  2. Jan 17, 2020 at 3:51 PM
    #32
    4X4Runner

    4X4Runner The Anti Pro, Pro! Staff Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2014
    Member:
    #2
    Messages:
    1,533
    Gender:
    Male
    The left coast
    Vehicle:
    2017 4Runner Smashed Ass Edition
    Mad driver mod. OME Suspension. 285/70R17 BFG AT KO2
    Here is a good video on its operation.
    https://youtu.be/NLF6n3nMwww
     
    SC2SC, WallyT4R and nimby like this.
  3. Jan 31, 2020 at 5:52 PM
    #33
    SKT_07

    SKT_07 New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2019
    Member:
    #12204
    Messages:
    78
    Do 4Runners w/ KDSS have more rake?
     
  4. Jan 31, 2020 at 5:55 PM
    #34
    Thatbassguy

    Thatbassguy New member? Really??

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2019
    Member:
    #9314
    Messages:
    6,275
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    James
    S/E Wisconsin
    Vehicle:
    2019 TRDORP, KDSS, MGM
    RSG sliders, Yakima offgrid basket, Pro-Comp wheels, SOS Streamline bumper and skids, Warn VR EVO10S winch + Ultimate Sidewinder, Bilstein 6112 + 5100 + rear lift coils, Rigid Dually SS ditch lights w/Caliraised brackets and OEM style dash switch
    No
     
  5. Feb 16, 2020 at 7:38 AM
    #35
    Thatbassguy

    Thatbassguy New member? Really??

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2019
    Member:
    #9314
    Messages:
    6,275
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    James
    S/E Wisconsin
    Vehicle:
    2019 TRDORP, KDSS, MGM
    RSG sliders, Yakima offgrid basket, Pro-Comp wheels, SOS Streamline bumper and skids, Warn VR EVO10S winch + Ultimate Sidewinder, Bilstein 6112 + 5100 + rear lift coils, Rigid Dually SS ditch lights w/Caliraised brackets and OEM style dash switch
    I'll be lifting my '19 ORP with KDSS in a few weeks.

    I was originally planning on using the ratchet strap method, but if I'm reading this right, I shouldn't NEED to do anything special other than be prepared to calibrate the system if necessary.

    @4X4Runner , am I understanding this correctly? Can I perform the lift without taking any special steps to accommodate the KDSS?

    I'll be using a friend's lift and working on both axles simultaneously. I am replacing the UCA's so that should help with the front strut assembly installation.

    Sorry, I know this has been discussed to death, but I'm just trying to decide which method to use.
     
  6. Feb 16, 2020 at 12:50 PM
    #36
    4X4Runner

    4X4Runner The Anti Pro, Pro! Staff Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2014
    Member:
    #2
    Messages:
    1,533
    Gender:
    Male
    The left coast
    Vehicle:
    2017 4Runner Smashed Ass Edition
    Mad driver mod. OME Suspension. 285/70R17 BFG AT KO2
    The suspension install/lift I did on my 2017 I did not do anything with the KDSS cylinders and I did not have to do the calibration. I’ve attached the calibration for your reference in case you need to do it post install.

    just back the valves out a few turns or else you risk allowing air into the system.
     
    Thatbassguy likes this.
  7. Feb 16, 2020 at 1:22 PM
    #37
    Thatbassguy

    Thatbassguy New member? Really??

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2019
    Member:
    #9314
    Messages:
    6,275
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    James
    S/E Wisconsin
    Vehicle:
    2019 TRDORP, KDSS, MGM
    RSG sliders, Yakima offgrid basket, Pro-Comp wheels, SOS Streamline bumper and skids, Warn VR EVO10S winch + Ultimate Sidewinder, Bilstein 6112 + 5100 + rear lift coils, Rigid Dually SS ditch lights w/Caliraised brackets and OEM style dash switch
    This is only if I need to do the calibration, correct? Otherwise I just don't touch it?
     
  8. Feb 16, 2020 at 2:33 PM
    #38
    4X4Runner

    4X4Runner The Anti Pro, Pro! Staff Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2014
    Member:
    #2
    Messages:
    1,533
    Gender:
    Male
    The left coast
    Vehicle:
    2017 4Runner Smashed Ass Edition
    Mad driver mod. OME Suspension. 285/70R17 BFG AT KO2
    Correct. Of the difference between driver and passenger side is more than .787” the do they calibration. If it’s under that, don’t touch it.

    the difference on mine post install was 1/4” so I didn’t need to do the calibration
     
  9. Feb 16, 2020 at 3:19 PM
    #39
    Thatbassguy

    Thatbassguy New member? Really??

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2019
    Member:
    #9314
    Messages:
    6,275
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    James
    S/E Wisconsin
    Vehicle:
    2019 TRDORP, KDSS, MGM
    RSG sliders, Yakima offgrid basket, Pro-Comp wheels, SOS Streamline bumper and skids, Warn VR EVO10S winch + Ultimate Sidewinder, Bilstein 6112 + 5100 + rear lift coils, Rigid Dually SS ditch lights w/Caliraised brackets and OEM style dash switch
    Thank you!

    That's what I was hoping to hear. I'm installing 6112's and I'm probably going to set the driver's side a notch higher to compensate for the lean.
     
  10. Mar 7, 2020 at 7:29 AM
    #40
    glwood54

    glwood54 Stop making me buy stuff!

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2019
    Member:
    #10964
    Messages:
    2,559
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Gary
    Albuquerque, NM
    Vehicle:
    2019 OR, KDSS, RSG sliders, Eibach struts/shocks, 265/70 Falken Wildpeaks
    Did you ever complete the lift with your KDSS?

    If/when you do, if you could document what you did (or didn't need to do) to work around the KDSS would be greatly appreciated!
     
  11. Mar 7, 2020 at 7:42 AM
    #41
    Thatbassguy

    Thatbassguy New member? Really??

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2019
    Member:
    #9314
    Messages:
    6,275
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    James
    S/E Wisconsin
    Vehicle:
    2019 TRDORP, KDSS, MGM
    RSG sliders, Yakima offgrid basket, Pro-Comp wheels, SOS Streamline bumper and skids, Warn VR EVO10S winch + Ultimate Sidewinder, Bilstein 6112 + 5100 + rear lift coils, Rigid Dually SS ditch lights w/Caliraised brackets and OEM style dash switch
    It's going on next Saturday. The plan for now is to not touch the KDSS stuff at all. I'll do the calibration afterwards if necessary.

    I'll update after it's complete
     
  12. Mar 7, 2020 at 7:49 AM
    #42
    glwood54

    glwood54 Stop making me buy stuff!

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2019
    Member:
    #10964
    Messages:
    2,559
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Gary
    Albuquerque, NM
    Vehicle:
    2019 OR, KDSS, RSG sliders, Eibach struts/shocks, 265/70 Falken Wildpeaks
    I look forward to hearing about it, thanks! My choices are to figure it out myself, pay an arm & a leg for a shop install, or drop the idea altogether...
     
    Thatbassguy likes this.
  13. May 3, 2020 at 11:26 PM
    #43
    Kyle B

    Kyle B New Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2020
    Member:
    #14116
    Messages:
    6
    Gender:
    Male
    Vehicle:
    2018 ORP
    This weekend I attempted to install a Toytec Boss Aluma 2.0 lift with JBA UCA'S, but I had to give up. Before I completely throw in the towel and pay for the install, I wanted to see if anyone had any insight for me. I removed the upper control arms, I opened up the KDSS shutter valves, I removed the front sway bar at the KDSS piston and hard mount, and I removed the bolts from the lower control arm ball joints. I was able to get the boss Aluma 2.0 driver side strut assembly in place, but the bottom bolt hole was way too low, and I could not get the lower control arm to go any lower. Any ideas to either compress the strut assembly or lower the lower control arm a little further? I did try compressing the spring, but it didn't seem to compress the whole strut assembly.

    From what I can tell there are only two additional options. I can detach the sway bar at the LCA, but will that allow the LCA to drop more? Or, I read that if you loosen the rear LCA cam bolt the LCA can drop 180 degrees, but they tend to cease and might not be a good idea to do myself?

    Thanks
     
  14. May 4, 2020 at 9:06 AM
    #44
    AccuTune Offroad

    AccuTune Offroad New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2019
    Member:
    #12129
    Messages:
    50
    Vehicle:
    2009
    2.5" Fox Suspension
    Thatbassguy likes this.
  15. May 4, 2020 at 1:15 PM
    #45
    Sundy

    Sundy New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2019
    Member:
    #11012
    Messages:
    58
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Ryan
    Monument, CO
    Vehicle:
    2019 4Runner TRD ORP
    You've got two options.
    1. Disconnect the sway bar from the LCA (this is what I did) and loosen the alignment cam bolts. the LCA drops down out of the way, super easy to feed the new assembly in. I left the UCA connected the the spindle which was sufficient to hold that all in place. You also need to remove the lower ball joint from the spindle.

    2. Keep fighting it and use a pry bar to "push" the LCA down far enough. In my option why struggle, it's two additional bolts.

    I had never worked on a truck with KDSS (I did my own suspension work in HS and college) and it took me about 6 hours total to install my lift. The ratchet straps worked wonders for compressing the piston and for pulling the swaybar back to the LCAm I used two.

    Hope that helps!
     
  16. May 4, 2020 at 1:56 PM
    #46
    Thatbassguy

    Thatbassguy New member? Really??

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2019
    Member:
    #9314
    Messages:
    6,275
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    James
    S/E Wisconsin
    Vehicle:
    2019 TRDORP, KDSS, MGM
    RSG sliders, Yakima offgrid basket, Pro-Comp wheels, SOS Streamline bumper and skids, Warn VR EVO10S winch + Ultimate Sidewinder, Bilstein 6112 + 5100 + rear lift coils, Rigid Dually SS ditch lights w/Caliraised brackets and OEM style dash switch
    You should be doing anything with the KDSS piston or valves! Just disconnect the sway bar and do the installation.

    There are several good write-ups on this site. Look back in this thread.
     
  17. May 4, 2020 at 3:21 PM
    #47
    Kyle B

    Kyle B New Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2020
    Member:
    #14116
    Messages:
    6
    Gender:
    Male
    Vehicle:
    2018 ORP
    Thanks for the help. I did search a lot of threads, and watched tons of videos, and had instructions from Toytec, but no one seemed to have an issue with getting that bolt lined up. And removing the sway bar from the piston, and not the LCA was what Toytec said to do, and they have a video how to reinstall it, which was basically with just jacking it up. Ironman 4x4 has a video that shows how to back out the actuator valves properly, and Toytec sent me a video of how to correct the KDSS lean by using the actuator valves as well.

    I suppose I'll make another attempt, but this time I'll disconnect the sway bar at the LCA. I saw a lot in this thread, but nowhere else, about strapping the KDSS up. Wouldn't this cause more tension on the sway bar at the LCA?

    Thanks again
     
    Thatbassguy likes this.
  18. May 4, 2020 at 3:29 PM
    #48
    Sundy

    Sundy New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2019
    Member:
    #11012
    Messages:
    58
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Ryan
    Monument, CO
    Vehicle:
    2019 4Runner TRD ORP
    The compressing of the piston keeps it better aligned for when you disconnect the swaybar. The write-up is well documented on a PDF over on T4R. I believe it's on page 12
     
  19. May 4, 2020 at 4:05 PM
    #49
    Thatbassguy

    Thatbassguy New member? Really??

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2019
    Member:
    #9314
    Messages:
    6,275
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    James
    S/E Wisconsin
    Vehicle:
    2019 TRDORP, KDSS, MGM
    RSG sliders, Yakima offgrid basket, Pro-Comp wheels, SOS Streamline bumper and skids, Warn VR EVO10S winch + Ultimate Sidewinder, Bilstein 6112 + 5100 + rear lift coils, Rigid Dually SS ditch lights w/Caliraised brackets and OEM style dash switch
    This is fine. My understanding is to disconnect the sway bar from the link on the passenger side and the piston on the driver's side before jacking it up.

    I would not mess with those valves until after the lift was completed. And, even then, only if it was necessary.(KDSS light on dash)

    Don't do this. You are correct. Some do this, but I believe it's easier if you don't.

    Not if you are disconnecting the sway bar from the piston.
     
  20. May 4, 2020 at 4:11 PM
    #50
    Kyle B

    Kyle B New Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2020
    Member:
    #14116
    Messages:
    6
    Gender:
    Male
    Vehicle:
    2018 ORP

    Then the only thing I didn't do is loosen the LCA cam bolts. You think that'll allow the LCA to drop further with the sway bar still attached to the LCA?
     
  21. May 4, 2020 at 4:17 PM
    #51
    Kyle B

    Kyle B New Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2020
    Member:
    #14116
    Messages:
    6
    Gender:
    Male
    Vehicle:
    2018 ORP
    On that T4R thread, I also saw you should start on the passenger side, and of course I started on the driver's side. Not sure if that will actually help or not.

    FYI, I was using a full vehicle lift, so that was why I thought opening up the valves like Ironman said would be fine. Not sure if it actually freed up the flow of the fluid or not. I think their reasoning was that you don't have to disconnect sway bar at all, but I don't see how that was possible. Maybe their coils are shorter.

    Anyway, you guys have been great. Sorry if it seems like I'm repeating things already documented, there just seems to be several options.
     
  22. May 4, 2020 at 4:42 PM
    #52
    nimby

    nimby in the drink

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2017
    Member:
    #3777
    Messages:
    3,161
    First Name:
    Jake
    California
    Vehicle:
    2018 SR5P 4WD
    This thread might help:

    https://www.4runners.com/threads/glwood54-vs-stock-4r.12659/page-2#post-140673

    Page 2 starts going into lifting with KDSS. There's a couple or PDFs with some detailed steps that may be useful.
     
    Thatbassguy likes this.
  23. May 12, 2020 at 6:02 PM
    #53
    Kyle B

    Kyle B New Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2020
    Member:
    #14116
    Messages:
    6
    Gender:
    Male
    Vehicle:
    2018 ORP
    So I ended up paying a Toyota mechanic to put it on. However, after driving it for a day, after I turn right and then go straight, it sounds like metal on metal grinding and then brake whining. I plan on taking it in, but any ideas? Should I be worried that the wheel spacers are a possible danger right now?IMG_20200511_163443.jpg
     
  24. Oct 15, 2020 at 12:04 AM
    #54
    DragonRunner

    DragonRunner New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2019
    Member:
    #11437
    Messages:
    42
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Skyler
    Phoenix
    Vehicle:
    White 2018 ORP w/ KDSS
    Shrockworks sliders; Orangebox MOLLE panel; CanvasBack cargo liner; parachord grab handles; glovebox/console org;
    My $0.02: I did not disconnect the KDSS sway bar in any way, ratchet the piston, or open the shutter valves. I was about to do all these things then read the King install instructions, noted the bold “DO NOT DISCONNECT KDSS SWAYBAR” in them, and followed along. I was able to avoid needing a prybar, a second person, or touching the cam bolts. I disconnected the spindle at upper ball joint, and tie rod (on passenger side only... but that was because I couldn’t get the driver side to disconnect with a hammer and didn’t have the Pittman tool). A lot simpler than I was expecting!
     

    Attached Files:

    Thatbassguy likes this.
  25. Nov 13, 2020 at 3:05 PM
    #55
    Amerxon555666

    Amerxon555666 New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2020
    Member:
    #17336
    Messages:
    20
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Paul
    Vehicle:
    Red 2021 4runner TRD off-road
    Stock
    Hello guys. Would anyone here recommend a spacer type leveling kit on a 2020 kdss equipped 4runner trd off-road? Looking to temporarily lift it with 2inch leveling kit and 1 inch rear.

    Thanks for your advice!
     
  26. Nov 13, 2020 at 3:40 PM
    #56
    Thatbassguy

    Thatbassguy New member? Really??

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2019
    Member:
    #9314
    Messages:
    6,275
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    James
    S/E Wisconsin
    Vehicle:
    2019 TRDORP, KDSS, MGM
    RSG sliders, Yakima offgrid basket, Pro-Comp wheels, SOS Streamline bumper and skids, Warn VR EVO10S winch + Ultimate Sidewinder, Bilstein 6112 + 5100 + rear lift coils, Rigid Dually SS ditch lights w/Caliraised brackets and OEM style dash switch

    Do you just want the look? If so, a spacer lift is probably fine.
     
  27. Nov 13, 2020 at 3:51 PM
    #57
    Amerxon555666

    Amerxon555666 New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2020
    Member:
    #17336
    Messages:
    20
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Paul
    Vehicle:
    Red 2021 4runner TRD off-road
    Stock
    Mainly just to give it a little stance. Just worried it will affect the kdss. I haven't really figured out which lift to get. Thanks
     
    Thatbassguy likes this.
  28. Nov 13, 2020 at 4:25 PM
    #58
    Thatbassguy

    Thatbassguy New member? Really??

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2019
    Member:
    #9314
    Messages:
    6,275
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    James
    S/E Wisconsin
    Vehicle:
    2019 TRDORP, KDSS, MGM
    RSG sliders, Yakima offgrid basket, Pro-Comp wheels, SOS Streamline bumper and skids, Warn VR EVO10S winch + Ultimate Sidewinder, Bilstein 6112 + 5100 + rear lift coils, Rigid Dually SS ditch lights w/Caliraised brackets and OEM style dash switch

    KDSS is fine up to about 3". There are tons of lift options depending on what you want to use it for. If it's a mall crawler, spacers are fine. For off-road use, coilovers are worth the money.
     
  29. Mar 27, 2021 at 10:35 PM
    #59
    Toyota.ARK

    Toyota.ARK New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2021
    Member:
    #20194
    Messages:
    80
    Gender:
    Male
    Vehicle:
    2021 Magnetic Gray TRD-ORP
    I have a running theory that kdss models with tss have an extreme rake.
     
  30. Mar 27, 2021 at 10:42 PM
    #60
    Thatbassguy

    Thatbassguy New member? Really??

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2019
    Member:
    #9314
    Messages:
    6,275
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    James
    S/E Wisconsin
    Vehicle:
    2019 TRDORP, KDSS, MGM
    RSG sliders, Yakima offgrid basket, Pro-Comp wheels, SOS Streamline bumper and skids, Warn VR EVO10S winch + Ultimate Sidewinder, Bilstein 6112 + 5100 + rear lift coils, Rigid Dually SS ditch lights w/Caliraised brackets and OEM style dash switch
    That would be incorrect. KDSS only affects side to side lean, and articulation.
     
    Toyota.ARK likes this.
To Top