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5th Gen Steering Wheel Shake: SOLUTIONS ONLY

Discussion in '5th Gen 4Runners (2010+)' started by James P, May 18, 2022.

  1. Jun 15, 2022 at 2:57 PM
    #121
    McSpazatron

    McSpazatron New Member

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    He was referring to what we were talking about a few posts up: Getting data to see if needle bearing bearing problem is or is not related to the shimmy.

    You would be one data point, since you had yours replaced, but youe wheel still shimmies.
     
  2. Jun 15, 2022 at 3:04 PM
    #122
    Tmiesowicz

    Tmiesowicz New Member

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    Glad I could provide that, unfortunately
     
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  3. Jun 15, 2022 at 5:45 PM
    #123
    Chris In Milwaukee

    Chris In Milwaukee New Member

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    I didn’t understand the significance of that kind of balance machinery. Thanks for the enlightenment of the technology. I’ll read up on it a bit more.:cheers:
     
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  4. Jun 15, 2022 at 9:20 PM
    #124
    7harper7

    7harper7 New Member

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    "As is well documented on the forum, the shimmy problem exists in every model within the 4R lineup, regardless of suspension, 4WD system or presence or lack of mods."


    Nothing new to Toyota and IFS suspension and it is also well documented that it exist on 3rd gen ,4th gen 4runners and all years Tacoma, and oh yea FJ's too dating back the 20 years I've been on forums.

    My 97,00,06 and 2010 4Runners,2000 and 2001 TRD Tacos all have had it to some degree depending on tires/suspension setup. My 22 garage queen doesn't have it.....yet ,but at 700 miles and stock wheels.

    First gen Tacos were the worst with a 62-68mph shake and forum ,it was known as the Taco Shake. ECGS bushings fixed or lessoned some of mine and higher castor numbers seems to work sometimes. They get worse with big lifts and tires.

    Anybody think maybe its the Toyota IFS suspension design on BOF vehicles as the culprit?? Maybe more castor designed into the front IFS ?You really think Toyota doesn't know about it after 25+ years of complaints? lol
    Their reply for years was put stock wheels, tires and suspension and it won't do that.

    Tires have to almost be perfect in balance and roundness or you get it .Even then somedays would be worse then others and somedays no shake and cold weather and she would for the first 5 miles and vice versa.

    I learned to not drive at the range it would shake ,usually around upper or lower 65mph ish.
    Like the doctor said" Does it hurt when you do this? Yep He said...so don't do that. Speed up or slow down and it goes away.
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2022
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  5. Jun 16, 2022 at 7:16 AM
    #125
    LuLu

    LuLu New Member

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    Why isnt our 2009 Camry and 2018 Highlander not having any wheel shakes or balancing Issues though ? Just curious
     
  6. Jun 16, 2022 at 7:24 AM
    #126
    Singleminded

    Singleminded New Member

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    I haven’t had it on any other car. And I’ve had a lot of cars of many makes.
     
  7. Jun 16, 2022 at 9:47 AM
    #127
    Tmiesowicz

    Tmiesowicz New Member

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    Aside from this steering wheel shimmy on a other noticed issue does anyone else notice the passenger seat shake while usually at highway speeds lol
     
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  8. Jun 16, 2022 at 12:41 PM
    #128
    dosomeplowin

    dosomeplowin New Member

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    I've been trying to pay closer attention lately to when the shimmy occurs. Has anyone else noticed that it will begin or stop after going through a slight curve on the freeway? That seems to be an inflection point in my driving lately. If it's going smooth with no shimmy, a slight turn will cause it to start and vice versa.
     
  9. Jun 16, 2022 at 12:51 PM
    #129
    Tmiesowicz

    Tmiesowicz New Member

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    Yep I stated that above as well I think.
     
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  10. Jun 16, 2022 at 3:33 PM
    #130
    7harper7

    7harper7 New Member

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    No idea on Camry and Highlander suspension/wheels? Never drove or even sat in one. Don't know what type of suspension or factory alignment . For one ,completely different design ,unibody vs BOF
    For reference,same platform ,I just sold my GS350 F sport and before that IS350 F and the factory caster spec on them is 7.1-8.0 degrees and never a problem ,rode smooth ,no shimmy and never had to go back to rebalance.

    On the 4Runners ,factory caster specs are 2.9-3.9 and I believe Tacomas/FJ's are the same. Toyota ...Caster was designed in low and I've gotten as much as 5.5 with aftermarket UCA's but had a little bump steer and tight steering . Probably designed in low to make steering easy and they never planned on aftermarket oversize tires and wheels. Personally, I like 5.0 caster on all my Toyota BOF trucks and what I shoot for. Some or I should say most alignment shops care about just getting within limits and end up on the low end, under 3.0. Which IMO makes it so you have to actually steer it all the time and leads to shimmy. But I've had shimmy with caster at 5.0 too with some wheel/tire /suspension combos .With the caster set high you can at least let off the steering wheel and it drives itself straight, which is what I like.
    Before that my x-wifes Yukon Denali's factory specs were 3.0-5.0 and rode best at 5.
     
  11. Jun 17, 2022 at 4:38 AM
    #131
    Tmiesowicz

    Tmiesowicz New Member

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    What I have been noticing is that I never get the shimmy when my trailer is behind the 4 runner with the atv on it. Weird.
     
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  12. Jun 17, 2022 at 11:56 AM
    #132
    Program pete

    Program pete New Member

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    Hey guys I just joined the forum and I can’t find the other threads talking about the shake/shimmy. But I was wondering why a ECGS bushing or a “clam shell bushing” would fix my 4runners shake?
     
  13. Jun 17, 2022 at 4:07 PM
    #133
    nimby

    nimby in the drink

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    It doesn't.

    It fixes a whirring noise that a bad needle bearing causes.
     
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2022
  14. Jun 17, 2022 at 6:53 PM
    #134
    Singleminded

    Singleminded New Member

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    Anyone try a strut tower brace?
     
  15. Jun 19, 2022 at 10:26 AM
    #135
    Singleminded

    Singleminded New Member

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    I solved my shimmy!

    (by remounting the OEM wheel and tire set :laugh::crapstorm:)

    Did it my driveway. Now not even a hint of shimmy or vibration. What a relief. Hoping for a real solution before winter when I’ll most need the new tires again.
     
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  16. Jun 19, 2022 at 11:14 AM
    #136
    ElectroBoy

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    How did you do that?
    Take off each wheel one at a time, put it back on, torque each lug nut in cross pattern to 76 ft-lbs?
    Anything else?
     
  17. Jun 19, 2022 at 12:58 PM
    #137
    Singleminded

    Singleminded New Member

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    Basically followed owners manual for replacing a flat, as I’ve done on other cars where I had two wheel sets with mounted and balanced tires and would switch between those sets seasonally.

    Specifically: Used a wheeled hydraulic floor jack to raise a corner at area of frame recommended in owners manual, raising it enough to take most of the pressure off the wheel but with the tread still touching the ground so the wheel wouldn’t spin when removing the lug nuts. Used a common four-way lug wrench to loosen the nuts, jacked the truck a bit higher, removed the wheel, replaced with old wheel and installed nuts in star pattern as per owners manual, using same four-way lug wrench.

    Got each nut about half tight and kicked at wheel in several places to make sure it was properly seated, tightened the nuts some more, then lowered it and tightened each nut the rest of the way in star pattern.

    Then repeated the process for each corner. Really doesn’t take that long.

    Used wheel chocks on opposite end of car for safety. Also slid a tire under the frame near jacking point so if the jack failed the truck would not fall with wheel removed and damage something.

    Took good test drive, came back and to be cautious went through all the nuts again to see if any needed tightening; they didn’t.

    This is how I’ve done it on other cars without issues.

    I do not have a good torque wrench but in my experience have had no problem relying on my sense that the nuts are very tight but not over tight. I may however get a good torque wrench and loosen and retighten one nut at a time to the recommended 76 pounds.

    That make sense?
     
    Last edited: Jun 19, 2022
  18. Jun 19, 2022 at 1:08 PM
    #138
    Spare Parts

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    .
    how many foot pounds of pressure per kick?
     
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  19. Jun 19, 2022 at 1:12 PM
    #139
    Singleminded

    Singleminded New Member

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    Exactly 76.1579

    PS For the record, the kicking is not specified in the owners manual :D In fact the manual does not make reference to any special measures to assure proper seating of the wheel, other than tightening the nuts in a star pattern to the recommended foot pounds.

    As noted in my reply to @ElectroBoy, everything was smooth as warm butter on my test drive, and has remained so on my drives since.
     
    Last edited: Jun 19, 2022
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  20. Jun 19, 2022 at 1:33 PM
    #140
    Tmiesowicz

    Tmiesowicz New Member

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    Confirm in a few days! Lol
     
  21. Jun 19, 2022 at 2:06 PM
    #141
    Singleminded

    Singleminded New Member

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    Planning on it!

    As I’ve mentioned in other posts, I never once noticed shimmy in the 13k miles and almost two years I ran the OEM wheels and tires. The shimmy started immediately after mounting TRD wheels with Michelin E Load tires, and continued throughout more than 400 miles of use after switching to Pirelli Scorpion ATs, with balance attempts on both sets of tires making only improvements not eliminating the problem.
     
  22. Jun 19, 2022 at 2:14 PM
    #142
    Tmiesowicz

    Tmiesowicz New Member

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    I guess I’m the opposite...might try new tires before trading in.
     
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  23. Jun 19, 2022 at 2:25 PM
    #143
    ElectroBoy

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    So, you attribute your previous shimmy to something wrong with the other set of tires/wheels?
     
  24. Jun 19, 2022 at 2:58 PM
    #144
    Singleminded

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    Oh for sure. I thought that was clear from my many posts on this topic. Never had a single shimmy or vibration problem through 13k miles and two tire rotations on the OEM wheels and tires.

    That OEM wheelset had been sitting stacked in my garage for about 1100 miles and more than two months. Put them back on this morning and not even a hint of shimmy or vibration since, inc on a good highway run at speeds ranging from 60 to 80.

    I have to assume that the newer wheelset is less well balanced than the OEM setup, despite a couple balancing attempts at different shops, or that the AT tread is just more prone to causing this issue. The OEM tires are in the touring category I believe, with much less aggressive tread.

    So I’m just going to stick with what works until winter. The OEM tires are passable if conditions aren’t slippery, though I’m no fan of the look or purpose of the 20” OEM rims. Maybe sometime before winter I’ll haul the TRD/Pirelli AT set to get another shop for yet another balance attempt. Or maybe I’ll do that just before winter and have them mounted during the same visit.
     
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  25. Jun 19, 2022 at 4:02 PM
    #145
    Singleminded

    Singleminded New Member

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    If I could do this all over again I’d just replace my OEM tires with Michelin Defenders. Or even get the TRD wheels and put Defenders on them instead of the ATs. But I’m $2k down on this new wheelset (partly cause I got a 5th one to be a matching spare).
     
  26. Jun 19, 2022 at 5:37 PM
    #146
    Tmiesowicz

    Tmiesowicz New Member

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    Ran ko2’s for the last 7 years, I hope the 4 runner accepts
     
  27. Jun 19, 2022 at 6:18 PM
    #147
    Singleminded

    Singleminded New Member

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    Fingers crossed. I really do think that tread design is a factor. How many people have this problem after a couple balance attempts on highway tires?

    I also wonder if it’s a less common problem for people who have strengthened the front frame with things like armor. Anything that makes the front structure more rigid might help. Just a theory.
     
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  28. Jun 19, 2022 at 8:20 PM
    #148
    ElectroBoy

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    @Singleminded , Good job on that finding. :thumbsup:
    With my OEM rims and stock Dunlop tires they were balanced really well when I bought it new. Due to lousy wet road performance I replaced them with Coopers. They shimmied and the tread pattern created a weird vibration so I returned them to Discount Tire and got Michelin ATs. No shimmies and I’ve been very happy with them on and off road, 50,000 miles later and still lots of tread left.
     
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  29. Jun 19, 2022 at 10:22 PM
    #149
    McSpazatron

    McSpazatron New Member

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    No. But mostly because I don't have strut towers. ;)
     
  30. Jun 20, 2022 at 1:12 AM
    #150
    Singleminded

    Singleminded New Member

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    Duh and SMH! What an idiot I am, I should be banned for asking that question! :sorry:
     
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