Trying to understand tires..

Hello world. I am in the process of buying a 5th-gen 4runner, looking at some 2023 ORP models with KDSS.

Now I've found a vehicle I like- good maintenance history, right, color, trim features etc.

However it has 20" wheels put on and a 1" spacer lift in front. After doing some research I don't want a spacer lift, and would prefer the OEM toyota ORP wheels.

The dealer was willing to remove the lift and swap out the wheels for me, covering the cost if I get some I like. I found some OEM wheels on marketplace with < 1,000mi on them for $360.

So now I'm looking at what kind of tires to get. I know there are lots of tire threads here, and I've been digging through them, but have run up against things I don't understand:

1. There are multiple posts suggesting tires like Falken Wildpeaks A/T, Nitto Terra Grapplers, and some others, that when I select in tirerack.com, it says these tires do not fit the vehicle ...?

2. Are SL rated tires fine for towing, or do I need XL or E rated tires? There might be situations where I am towing up to the capacity of the 4runner.

3. My use case is this will be a daily driver, that I also take camping into the desert / woods. Occasionally I will tow a trailer with a sound system, which I need to figure out the exact weight but will definitely be close to the max.

Thank you for any help and insight!

EDIT: In regards to tirerack saying the tires don't fit, I am extremely new at all this and was looking at the wrong Wildpeaks. Not sure what the issue with the Nitto's was.

 

1) I have Falken's on my OEM wheels. They fit. Maybe the website thought you had a different wheel or something?

2) SL's will do just fine for towing and daily driving. E rated tires are for people who off road a lot harder. It has a tougher sidewall. But it's also a lot heavier. Example: Falken makes a 265/70 tire in SL and E. The SL is about 12lbs lighter.

3) My use case is similar to yours. I don't wheel hard and I keep my SloRunner on the pavement a lot because it's my daily commuter, so I run Falken AT's in SL form. I stuck with the OEM size tire too.

 

Welcome

 

Awesome thank you for the feedback. I got some new search terms and reading up on SL vs E came to the same conclusion. Previously my car was a Honda CRV and I managed to make it across many rocks and dips just fine in whatever tires were on there, was mostly worried about towing. Also feel pretty settled on the AT/3W or 4W tires. Going to see about powder coating the OEM wheels black...

EDIT:

Ah one more thing I'm trying to look into, I've read something about the wheels having a TPMS? So when I'm buying the OEM wheels off marketplace, should I look to make sure this is present? or is this something in my car that should already be there, and maybe just needs to be re-programmed?

 

What size were you looking at? I think OEM size for the 17's is 265/70r17. It should say those fit

 

@DuneArchitect Goodluck on your decision. I would go with SL.
I barely tow and I don’t really wheel on sharp or risky terrain, but load E 10-ply’s have been virtually indestructible for me when driving through Canadian forests w/ broken timber/stumps, and in regards to punctures (I have picked up multiple nails, screws, even a lag bolt thats still in there after the hex head broke off lol - never lost a single lb of pressure).
I’m confident in the heavy pigs, but that’s also cuz they’re mighty Mickey Thompson’s.

Mickey Thompson Baja ATX load E 55.6lbs
Mickey Thompson Sidebiter II wheels 29lbs

 

Yeah so it says the Falken Wildpeak A/T4W will fit, but that the A/T3W will not. That doesn't seem right... I was leaning towards the AT3W's since they are lighter and quieter on the highway. I think what this must be saying is they just don't have it in stock, I think they might be discontinued

 

About TPMS: If they are all OEM from Toyota you should be fine. You can reprogram them in the dash and get them to read. If any of them get damaged while mounting new tires, you'll have to replace them all. This happened to me two years ago. Discount tire damaged one of the sensors. They replaced it with an aftermarket and tried several times to get them to sync up. After trying a few more time I decided to purchase after market sensors.

I can see all 4 tire pressures in the dash with the after market TPMS'.

 

So the wheel itself should have a TPMS sensor in it?

 

Yes. It has (had) factory TPMS. Your 2023 should have it also, unless the previous owner removed or damaged them when he put on the 20 inch wheels.

 

ya they’re discontinued in favor of the at4w

 

I think ur ‘23 ORP comes with TPMS’s, my ‘16 did not

 

I see so likely the wheels I buy will not have the monitors, because they are in that person's truck and mine _should_ be in this truck. Thanks for all the help!

 

The wheels currently on your truck have tpms, they are more than likely the factory set. Depending on where you are doing most of your driving, Walmart has some good prices on tires. Dunlop Grandtreks with a 60k mile warranty for $158 per tire, or Cooper Discoverer A/T with 60k mile warranty for $153. I have had both of those tires and got over 50 k. I purchased a matching wheel and tpms and rotate 5 tires.

 

Maybe
I’d have to read more into your tpms questions, but I should mention to you - don’t sell your ORP factory wheels hastily, they are saught after wheels that are 7.5” wide and offer valve stem protection among other benefits. I sold mine on fb marketplace in seconds, for too cheap, when I “upgraded” to 9” wide. Not holding onto those wheels is one of my biggest 4R regrets, in the same category as my foolish viper cut lol.

 

Sometimes the reason a tire is is claimed to not fit has nothing to do with the size of the tire, but with the load index. BF Goodrich T/A KO2’s are not recommended by BF Goodrich for the 4Runner for that reason. Load index is often ignored when choosing tires, but as you say you’ll be towing near the maximum weight you might keep it in mind.

For your convenience:


The table is from this thread.

 

What size tire did you specify on Tire Rack? Your stock tire size shown on the door jamb label is 265/70-17. Picking a different size on Tire Rack "will not fit". Picking a tire with lower than stock "T" speed rating (118 mph) on Tire Rack may also come up negative, even if it will be completely fine for your planned usage.

 

Huh okay this is something I hadn't considered. So load index of a tire is how much weight the car itself can weigh? Towing a trailer doesn't put all the weight directly on the car... any resources where I can understand this in more detail?

Right now I'm looking at the Cooper Discovered SL Rated tires, or the Falken Wildpeaks AT4W SL

 

https://www.discounttire.com/learn/load-range-load-index

Speed rating can also affect compatibility too despite the size being the same. Generally not downgrading in speed rating is best practice. I believe for our vehicles it’s S or T minimum.

For weight calculations take note of expected tongue weight. But I don’t expect the need to upsize load range for towing unless the vehicle itself might be overloaded.

 

I’m not an authority on towing. But while towing a trailer doesn’t put all the trailer’s weight on the car it does put a significant amount onto it. If you look at the sticker on your drivers door jamb it will give you the maximum payload weight including passengers and gear.


Photo: kmeeg

It’s not as high a number as you might think. Remember that when we talk about towing we must consider the trailer’s weight and the tongue weight, and the tongue weight counts against the cargo weight. And some times the situation occurs that if you have a vehicle full of people and the cargo area is full of gear and some more stuff on the roof rack plus the added trailer tongue weight you could easily run into a situation where the vehicle is overloaded.

But that’s all beside the point. If you look at the chart above, at the top is the Dunlop tire came stock on my 4Runner. Directly below it is the BFG T/A K02. The K02 is a very popular tire on 4Runners. But it’s not “recommended” even in the stock size, even with its “C” load range. And the reason is because its specified load index is lower than the stock Dunlops.

 

The TPMS sensor is usually mounted to the valve stem which is where you fill up your tires with air. I’ve worked on putting many tires on new wheels and usually they get broken when someone doesn’t know how to correctly mount tires on wheels. Any shop worth their salt will have a device that can program the TPMS sensors to communicate with your vehicle. I’m sure you have all the information you need, just a side note.

 

Okay thank you so much for the replies everyone. Interesting about the load index, I actually landed on some C Rated 265/70/17 Toyo Open Country RT Trails, which also have a load index of 112. Looking at some other threads it’s “probably fine” ..?

Changing gears a bit here.. at least on the topic title- I’m pretty sure I want to remove the spacer lift. The dealership almost convinced me to keep it, and I’m a super noob and don’t know much about suspension, lifts, or cars tbh. What I do know is I don’t need it with the stock size tires I’m getting, and that everything I see online indicates they’re not good and could cause issues. Any voices to the contrary? Here’s a picture from the driver side wheel

 

take the spacer out. No issues there.

 

That’s a TOYTEC 2.5” spacer lift.
Not a fan of spacers if possible.

 

I currently have a '23 TRD ORP with KDSS and previously had a '18 TRD ORP. One interesting and possibly important point on tire fit that no one has mentioned yet is that the offset is different between the OEM silver/black wheels (rims) and the TRD wheels. I put 275 E KO2s on my '18 using the OEM Silver/Black wheels and experienced no fit or rub issues for the entire time I owned it. But when I originally got my '23, I purchased another set of 275 E KO2s for them along with the black TRD wheels and these rubbed on the fender wells by about 1/4" in reverse at full right turn (backing left). At the time, the concept of what even a little difference in offset would do was beyond my consideration. Much research and self-education helped me to understand it better. My eventual 'solution' was to chop the fenders, change everything up, and do a full lift.

This tire fit calculator can be a good resource (and its fun to play with) : If you need TPMS sensors for new / used tires, you don't have to buy them from the dealer or tire store. I purchased mine from Amazon -

$28 Schrader EZ-Sensor GO The Market’s Fastest programmable TPMS Sensor! Tire Pressure Monitoring System- 33560 tire Pressure Sensor (One Sensor)

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0BYTD15NQ - after a strong recommendation from a tire shop employee. They work great with my '23 TRD ORP and have been installed since November 2023 (1.5 years).

 

Awesome thank you all. I’m replacing the 20” wheels with OEM wheels off marketplace (supposedly only 1K miles on them) that I’m getting powder coated black. Then the tires are all terrain but stock size, so I should be completely fine no rubbing even taking the spacer out

 

Um — depends on which OEM wheels. If you get the SR5 or ORP wheels which have a +15mm offset you will have no rubbing with a stock size tire. But if you get wheels like the ones on a TRD Pro, with a +4mm offset, you should be aware that when those wheels are fitted to the TRD Pro by Toyota, with AT tires, Toyota cuts the front fenders.

https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2019/MC-10162789-9999.pdf

 

I’m getting the ORP wheels so should be good! Sorry should have specified