4Runner vs Wrangler... how my first experience in Moab shaped my opinion on this battle

Hello all!

So I recently went to Utah and explored the southern part of Utah starting from Bryce, Escalante, and then Moab. We went there a few weeks back and I cannot express how much more I love Utah after this trip. We had been to Utah before, but this was the first time we got to explore more off-road and did a lot of hikes and some more sightseeing. As avid outdoorsy people, my wife and I want to go back and we will later this year.

To the topic in hand... the good old battle between the 4Runner and Wrangler.

For this trip, we rented a Wrangler Rubicon that we were allowed to off-road and were given an off-road book for all the Moab trails and were given a list of good trails and trails that were strictly prohibited. To my surprised (I should've paid attention or asked) the JL Wrangler Rubicon we rented was lifted and was sitting on Mickey Thompson MT 37s... what a BEAST! The rental place did an amazing job with it. The steering column shaft and all were excellent and even the gearing was perfection. I am absolutely shocked that little 2.0 turbo can handle that weight honestly... and yes I am not here to debate any of this I know most of us don't like the idea of 4-bangers in off-road rigs.

This Wrangler was such a beast, mostly did greens that had some slick rock spots and did blues with a lot of slick rock and steps which was my first time experiencing myself (especially being from the northeast) and I did excellent. Didn't need lockers, most I used was 4L in some climbs and disconnected the sway bar which increased the flex tremendously. In serious off-roading, a lifted Wrangler on 37s is just and unstoppable beast. However, its Achilles' heel are washboards on easy dirt roads... the solid front axle makes the truck rattle like an earthquake... was it the OMU lifted suspension and the 37s? Maybe. Even aired down it didn't help one bit. On highway, the gearing and did help a lot with speed especially since the speed limit on I-70 is 80 MPH... but the crosswinds do make the truck unstable which is expected.

As much as I loved the roughness and toughness of the Wrangler... it made me appreciate my 4Runner even more. In Moab, I saw a lot of stock 4Runners and some lifted tackle the same blue-rated trails without a problem. But one huge difference that woke me up more was that obviously the majority of the time we drive on pavement... and that's where the 4Runner outshines the Wrangler. The Wrangler is an absolute beast, but I can't comprehend how anyone daily-drives them, they're extremely uncomfortable to be road-tripping and daily-driving. Interior was nice though, definitely can't complain there. Only way I'd ever get a Wrangler would be if I did live in Utah and use it mainly for off-roading, but as-is, the 4Rrunner is the absolute best compromise all around and ofc the reliability is outstanding. I do have a fantasy now to bring my ORP to Moab, but would like to rent a pick-up truck and tow it there, don't want to put all those 2000+ miles from the east coast haha! But I know my ORP with the WildPeaks and rock-sliders can easily do 90% of the blue trails in Moab. I don't want to do any harder trails whether Wrangler or not. If I want to do something like Hell's Gate, I'd rather get a SxS which are way better than either a Wrangler or 4Runner for the more extreme stuff.

 

put 37s on a 4runner and they will suck at the same washboard too, unsprung weight is unsprung weight, you can't change physics.

I suspect if the Wranglers had the similar suspension and tires as you 4runner they would be a lot more to your taste for on road driving. I bought a base Wrangler on 31s that has since become a spare car for my parents and and it's...fine for freeways. Louder? Sure, the soft top does that. Does it have the slight "hop" that SFA has on bumps? Sure. But there is a big gap between a Wrangler that is set up similar to a stock 5th gen, versus a rental that is tricked out for Moab. Oh and it's a 2 door and has a 6 speed manual which my pop loves.

And this sums up why we will never have the likes of Jimnys even if they figured out how to pass the crash test standards and use small turbo motors: people will still (objectively correctly) point out they are sub-optimal for commuting.

 

That's what I figured. At least my 4R I've taken it on washboarded roads here and the shaking is nowhere near as bad as the 37s. Smoooooooooooooooth.

This is what I'd like just an old JK or JL 2-door and manual. Just a toy. But if I was Utah it would be hard to decide between that or SxS.

I think in the case of the Jimny it's more of the crash test and EPA standards. Most off-roaders would love to have them here, hell even more normal people would like them. Just sucks so bad that all vehicles are so damn bloated for crumple zones and the CAFE standards.

 

I was offroading with this guy on the pic. I took my time and did everything in hells revenge. Even hells gate. I can see you doing it next year! Your rig can do it!

 

No offense to the guy's Jeep, but I hate when people mod them like that with such a large tire offset. It may be capable, but it just looks like a huge, adult RC toy

 

I had a very similar experience recently renting a 4xe Rubicon for some trails in SoCal, and my takeaways were almost identical to yours.

That hybrid 4-banger is surprisingly punchy on mountain roads, but man, those washboards beat the hell out of us! Even on 33s (same as my 4Runner at the time), the difference in how IFS handles high-speed chatter vs. the Wrangler's solid front axle is night and day. It really makes you appreciate the 4Runner's ability to soak that stuff up!

I did run into some frustrations—the lockers and swaybar disconnects were glitchy when I actually needed them—but you can't deny that live-axle flex. It makes me curious about a dedicated trail rig, maybe a 2015 JK or an SAS’d 1st Gen 4R, but it also solidified why I own a 5th Gen.

The 4Runner is the ultimate Swiss Army knife. It’s not the "best" at any one specific thing, but it does everything—camping, road trips, and technical trails—well enough that there aren’t many compromises. Hard to imagine a better all-rounder!

 

(FYI, the 1st gen has solid axles factory so wouldn't have to swap it)

 

Only early first gens

specifically 84-85
86-89 were ifs.

 

I rented a Wrangler Sahara before and it was pretty comfortable on the road. Obviously a solid front axle gives a rougher ride than IFS and also creates bump steer. If I was into serious offroading I would either buy an old wrangler and hack it up to fit massive tires or buy a side by side.

 

Oh! Really? Didn't know that detail. Now I know I need to narrow my search to 84-85s... Hard enough to find ANY first gens around my area. I really want one.

 

@1SilverRunner nice profile photo update.

 

Come to Jambo next year. I swear 90% of them come out there lmfao

 

Yeah that's where they all live lol. If I come down I'd have to convince one of the owners to sell lol

 

I was... um... er... looking at 4Runners to buy today hehe. (Probably shouldn't be... not in my budget at the moment lol). I almost fell off the toilet (yeah I look at cars on the crapper lol) at the prices. 4th gen with 410,000 kilometers, mint condition is $12,000 CAD. 3rd gen with 376,000 kilometers, not close to mint is $7,500 CAD. Holy sh*t 4Runners hold their value (or people ask too much). I'm definitely gonna need to save for a while if I want another one!

 

Yeah the sport, sahara, willys, whatever trims with the more normal tires are fine for normal every day driving. Even the regular Rubicons with the LT 33s aren't too bad.

 

Was your 4xe lifted as well? Mine had the Old Man Emu lifted suspension with the external reservoir. It did feel a little too stiff on pavement... I assume it's so you don't get the death wobble? I imagine that if the Wranglers were as bouncy as our stock 4Runners they would death wobble a lot more often! That's recipe for disaster. I had the non-4xe and by itself that little engine did really good... but like I said still skeptical about long-term reliability especially with these heavy 37s and lifts and blah blah blah.

My ORP soaks up washboards like nothing, I love that. It's like "desert running".

Wow really? My sway bar disconnect and the lockers engaged faster than my ORP which was nice. Sometimes in my ORP I have to basically wait a few seconds longer and turn the steering more ever so slightly for the teeth to engage.

It truly is! That's my whole point of this post. Even though I had the ultimate beast of a Wrangler it made me love my 4Runner even more. My whole logic is this: do I want to do really hard trails like Behind the Rocks or Steel Bender? Nope. If I really want to do that I'd just get a SxS. Those seem to shine the brightest in the hardest of trails. I know our stock 4Runners can do things like Hells Gate and such, but I wouldn't wanna risk it it all, not even in a Wrangler. A SxS is the perfect toy for the real hard stuff.

 

Nice! I do want to do Hells Revenge in my ORP but not the side stuff like Hells Gate. I need a pick-up truck or get a full size SUV and tow my ORP.

 

No sir it was bone stock. 50k miles with the stock 33" K02's.

The "hybrid" capability wasn't very useful for me since it ran out of charge in an hour or so of driving. I had the car for a week and had enough electric power for maybe 2-3 hours total (I never found a charge station for it. Some power came from regenerative braking though)... Still, that turbo 4 banger was pretty punchy.

I liked it but I couldn't imagine owning one outside of it's warranty period... Which makes mods a no go for me. I can only justify modifying long term vehicles lol.

Older JK? Worth considering for a trail rig imo. But a newer JL/JLU? ... I'm good. Not a reliable enough to be a good daily driver and too expensive to be a dedicated trail rig.

 

I think with some patience and a good spotter your 4Runner will surprise you.

I got a stock ORP up a level 4 trail at Jambo the other day. Took some finesse and clever tire placement but I got him through with no damage. The owner was absolutely ecstatic!

 

Nice! I stubbornly did it from bottom to top and it made me pucker haha. So fun though, loved the sharp turns on the switchbacks with slick rock, made it scary.

 

Where's the Jamboree?

 

Gilmer Texas - Barnwell Mtn recreational area.
Usually held in late April.

I just got back from it this week and had a blast. Huge turnout this year since it was the 20th anniversary event.

People drive from all over to come check it out. Its worth the drive.

Pg 5 of my build thread has some pictures and videos if you're interested
https://www.4runners.com/threads/1silverrunners-build-and-adventures-thread.43247/page-5

 

Here's a couple of vids showing the getting in and getting out of Hells Gate. 2018 SR5, no locker and ATRAC is engaged. 275's with 18 psi.

https://photos.google.com/photo/AF1QipN8nDJFy9JheK9cOQ6laWUYc6HQOqzd0nx963gn

https://photos.google.com/photo/AF1QipM-SMtyoL1eN6Wngk-mJae_tFR8kee4TnF9G3Ic

 

4th gens in particular are absolutely ridiculous in price right now. There are 20 year old ones by me with 115k on the ODO going for $20k!! Insane…

 

I just bought what I considered a good deal. 2003 v8 SR5 with 170k and a nice clean interior. The clear coat is peeling and it had rust that was technically fixable without pulling the body but I couldn't stand the thought of not doing everything possible to stop it. Just over 6k otd at a Dodge dealer. It was worth it.

 

Not bad at all. Prices are outrageous here

 

Another thing I noted driving new Wrangler Rubicon with xtream package (35in BFG KO2) hardtop in winter is, I felt the cold on my head. The plastic / composite material roof doesn't seem to have any insulation for the cold winters.

I don't know how it would behave in summer. I easily get headache so if the roof get hot it may not be a good vehicle for people like me. When we road trip 4runner we keep the windows & moonroof closed and use A/C or heating based on the weather.

I also noticed lot of noise inside the vehicle. I bet sound insulation also at a minimal / if any.

(Not personally Tested, LoL) If I'm not mistaken Wrangler didn't get full side curtain air bags till 2024.

 

@engineer90 if stoney can do it in his bone stock 4R, you can do it too!
Seriously, if you have a decent spotter and you take your time, you can go many places with your 4R. I have taken a few lessons here and there and by no means i am no expert but the capability of the 4R is there. You just need to know how to use it. Go for it!

 

Nahhh I'm good I love my ORP too much to be putting it in that type of danger. Only way I'd do any of the harder stuff would be if I had a beater 2-door JK or a SxS... especially a SxS seems like their full independent suspension outshines solid axles in these. I'd like to explore Behind the Rocks and Steel Bender in a SxS.