Better than ToyTec

I’ve got a 2020 TRD Off Road with a ToyTec lift. It’s been on there since almost new. We’d like to be using the rig off road more but the ride is totally jarring. Consequently we would turn to our other vehicle, a 2004 Land Rover Discovery, for our off roading because it was plush in comparison. It’s at the end of its life now though.

I’ve seen several thread about the “best” suspension kits but does “best” mean best off road ride and articulation? That’s what I’m after. BTW, I have KDSS.

I’ll spend the money for improvement but will be bummed by another stiff ride.

 

Bilstein 8112 and 8100's (the internal bypass version with adjusters) will get you a very nice ride if you don't mind spending $4k.

 

+1 on this. I just went from Toytecs to the Bilsteins on my Tundra. @memario1214 can hook you up.

 

I wonder if it would be a good thing to spend less on KDSS bypass unit and see how you think on trails. Saying because I felt KDSS be jarring on trails. But I haven't a chance to felt a KDSS 4Runner with the KDSS bypass gadget installed.

Also hope you haven't gone with max preload on front and have heavy spring rear without any weight.

 

I've been studying on shocks lately and it seems every setup made for the 4R in the standard name-brands are all digressive valving. You gotta spend big money on Kings and the like to get progressive valving.

I found a single set of shocks made for the 4R with progressive valving, its the Rancho RS5000X

https://www.shocksurplus.com/produc...strut-shocks-set-for-2003-2022-toyota-4runner

>The Rancho RS5000X series design includes patented progressive rebound and compression discs. At lower speeds or in the earlier stages of the shock's travel, an eccentric disc in the valve shim stacks will engage the valving at lower frequencies, helping to control the energy of motion as the cycle of the shock increases or decreases in its action. When hitting a pothole, off-road trail obstacle or similar activity, Rancho's Progressive Engagement Valving allows for early flow of fluid, helping to reduce harsh initial impacts and to control the flow of fluid in a progressive, gradual manner through the valving. During on- or off-road driving activities like washboarding or when travelling a rough fire road, the early flow of fluid helps to minimize a "rough" ride as the piston movement is able to glide through the initial travel motion of the shock with minimal ground impact or force. If needed, the Progressive Engagement Valving will further engage to maintain control and stability.<


>Small Bump & Washboard:
Small bumps and washboard surfaces cause the wheel to move very quickly, but with very small displacements. Due to the minimal movement, the valve disks in the shock may not have enough time to open properly. As a result, these forces typically occur around 2 to 10 in/sec for both compression and rebound. Looking at the graph, we can see that digressive pistons would likely feel stiff and possibly harsh, while progressive shocks would offer a much smoother ride. Since the movements are so small, factors like tire pressure and tire stiffness can have a significant impact on ride comfort.<

 

Definitely described to the shop where I bought it, ToyCrawlers in Broomfield, CO, that I didn’t need the heavy weight kit because I wasn’t adding bumpers and camping trips are one to two nights max.

 

That’s what I wonder. KDSS lends on road stability and more articulation off road (vs. no KDSS) but the ride over small obstacles cannot be softened.

 

The KDSS controller @kmeeg is referring to is said to soften up the ride at higher speeds (12MPH+) by opening the valves. I haven't tried it myself, though.

 

Also don't forget about tires, if you have Load E tires.
When I change from Load C to Load E tires from same brand BFG KO2 I felt like "oh sh#t, what have I done?" Feeling. I had to sell them quickly and get back to Load C tires.

 

Welcome from Wisconsin! The Bilsteins that nimby is talking about will improve your ride, so will Elka Shocks, which are $4K+ also. Good luck on picking out those new shocks.

 

welcome

 

Dobinsons are linear valved.

 

Back when I was looking down the shock upgrade rabbit hole, I determined that the vast majority of the nitro mono tube shocks such as the 5100 certainly stiffened things up. But I didn’t want to experience a harsh ride during normal daily driving just so I could drive like the Dukes of Hazzard while on a trail.

So I was seriously considering the Ironman foam cell shocks. Apparently their design is less susceptible to shock fade during long washboard driving and they have a softer ride.

After much soul searching and meditation I decided that the juice just wasn’t worth the squeeze for me personally. Plus I actually like the squishy ride that the stock shocks provide.

 

I would look at Dobinsons if not looking to get a custom valved set of (pick your brand).

Ride height is based on spring selection, not preload, which allows for more suspension travel.

Dobs spring can also be used on Bilstein 6112’s so you aren’t eating into suspension travel by setting the clips (preload). I would think you would likely need to adjust for drivers side lean slightly, but nothing drastic that would result in a compromised ride.

 

I switched from Eibach to Dobinsons and I was very happy with the ride...until I rode in a KING shock equipped GX

Don't get me wrong, for the money spent, the Dobinsons IMS is a fantastic suspension IMO. The ride quality both on and off road has been excellent. Oddly, the ride improves with a bit more weight in the car. For reference, I have KDSS as well.

Research KINGs or Fox custom tuned by Accutune. The staff at Accutune has an impressive amount of knowledge on custom setups.

 

Premium suspension are not worth the coin for most users. Definitely improved ride but up to each person if diminishing returns on the cost. I was convinced Dobinson IMS was what I wanted. Went with Elka after very well respected shop told me they were the best and also what they run on their vehicles.

Low and high speed adjustment is nice for tuning the ride. But I think your moving to premium shocks for this feature. This is where I went all in going remote reservoir.

I still think the Dobinsons are the most bang for your buck non premium shock. Everyone has their own opinion and use case/goals.

 

Maybe we should start with which Toytec lift?

 

It is the BOSS Suspension System…about $1,500 when I bought it in 2020.

 

How much do you want to spend?

 

It’s a good question, I started the thread trying to find out if my complaint of poor ride can even be fixed. It sounds like the answer is yes, significant improvement is possible. Can I get the significant improvement for $2k? If so, I’ll do that but if the real noticeable, substantial improvement requires $5k I would spend that and settle into keeping the truck for a longer term.

I want to be able to run trails for most of a day without the aches and fatigue I have now.

 

The digressive valving of practically every aftermarket budget shock made for a 4R is going to be VERY stiff on the small bumps, 1-3" ledges and small rocks are going to feel like you are on almost no suspension. The valving isnt allowing fluid to flow thru the shim stack fast enough so those small little "bumps" feel pretty solid.

A stock shock with strut spacers would likely ride better. A set of progressive valved shocks is no doubt the simple fix. From my research there is only one shock with progressive valving and that is the Rancho RS5000, i have an email in them asking about their RS9000 system with adjustment knob for ride control to see how they compare to the RS5000 but no reply yet. All the higher end shocks like King and Elka appear to run a progressive valving setup. I showed a chart of the differences in the valving and some explanation above.

 

With that amount to spend, your best bet is to get in contact with accutune. See what they have to offer and what they recommend.

I love the ride quality of my fox trd pro shocks, on and offroad. But they are limited in rear lift height(imo) I wouldn't want to go over 1.5" or else down travel would be sacrificed

 

The other thing to consider with Kings, Elkas, etc., is the rebuild interval and if that is something you are willing to entertain for the ‘best’ performance.

I’m removing my Fox Pro setup, for me the rear is a bit too soft for my 99.9% on road driving at the moment. The internal bypass of the fronts are excellent.

The Eibach 1.4/1.0 springs with a Fox setup may be something to try out.

 

Here's the thing....

I've heard Toytec's ride like shit from multiple sources but I haven't tried them myself. They don't get the best reviews.

So could you get significant improvement by spending $2k? More than likely, yes.

If it was me spending the money, I'd spend about $3k and get a set of Bilstein 6112's up front and Bilstein 8100 bypasses with adjusters in the back.

Lots of people really like their 6112's as a solid mid-range option. More can speak on them if you're curious.

The reason I would pick 8100's for the rear is because in my opinion, rear suspension improves the overall ride quality more so than the front. With the 8100's being fully adjustable, you can tailor exactly how you want the compression and rebound to react so that it fits your driving style (with and without weight). I prefer the rear to be softer than the front and with the 8100's, you can make those sorts of adjustments.

Now if you want to step it up from there, you could have that same adjustability on the front by putting 8112's on, but that will cost an extra $2k.

There are a ton of options, but that is one to consider. It may sound counterintuitive, but I think having the more expensive (and adjustable) shocks in the rear is the call for achieving an overall softer, more enjoyable ride.