Toyota 3.4L TT recall

Ha!

I'm gen X.

Having to buy a brand new vehicle so that you can give your kid a late model used vehicle sounds like first world problems to me.

Maybe you should buy one of those Hondas that's still available with a V6.

 

You'd sure think so.

And, if that's the case, why haven't they?

 

You’re sounding like a boomer with the “back when I was a kid” talk.
You can’t get a cheap used vehicle anymore. I’d rather hand me down one of our reliable vehicles that we know the maintenance history of than get some unknown POS. That process will get repeated with kid number two. That was the plan when buying two long lasting Toyotas.
A Honda with the V6 or a Nissan are currently top contenders for the next new vehicle.

 

I don’t think it’s the issue. I think there is a major internal design flaw with those engines.

 

That should be the case, but its hard to fix it once all of them have potentially mushroomed the bearings out due to tuning issues.
Thats what leads me to believe the new long blocks are putting in bottom ends and also likely getting a software flash / update after the engine install.
Me thinks in order to meet emissions, the AFR might be lean which causes super high cylinder temps. Super high cylinder temps along with super high intake air temps causes the fuel to flash ignite before the spark plug fires. This is detonation, the fuel igniting on its own while the piston is on the up-stroke which causes incredible pressures against the piston / rods / bearings. The direct injection the new Tundra has will produce 500+psi of fuel pressure to atomize the fuel better to get better combustion, this tiny atomization makes it FAR easier to detonate as well.

 

That's what it seems like. The debris story sounded like BS, not that it's impossible to imagine.

It's pretty bad that they're having problems after this many years. If it was something that could be cured with tuning, that would be really embarrassing.

 

I guess I haven't looked at used vehicles in awhile. I'd think you could get a decent Corolla or something similar for a few thousand $$.

I'd certainly rather pass down a well maintained vehicle to a kid if it was an option. But, I'm sure some people's kids still have to buy their own.

 

The 2007-2009 4runners are easily found for sale these days and these are what i would consider the absolute peak of reliability followed only by the 2010-2012 4Runners. The 2013+ got the air injection system which adds one more thing to go bad over its life.

The 2007-2009 4th gen 4Runners are great starter vehicles for kids, they are a bit smaller than the 5th gen and seem to have all the quirks ironed out. The earlier years of 4th gens had some potential problems that all seem to have been lined out after 2006. Look on Copart and Market place at the 2007-2009 models and you will see crap tons of them with 250-350k miles for sale that are still good running and driving vehicles. Its also not hard to find one of these with 170,000-200,000 on the clock which means its typically got at least another 100,000 left under its belt.
The next best in my opinion are the early 5th gen 2010-2012. These are crazy reliable as well, there are so many with over 300,000 now still running and they never seem to have major mechanicals. Any problems i have seen with them have typically been electrical, sunroof leaking water down the A-pillar into the electrical components in the kick panel and critters under the hood. If you do the maintenance on both of these year models of vehicles you have an uber reliable vehicle that you can buy for pennies on the dollar compared to new.

I can find you dozens of listings of NICE 2007-2009 4runners with 200k on the clock for $7,500-$10,000
I can find you dozens of listings of NICE 2010-2012 4runners with 200k on the clock for $9,500-$12,500
A fully decked out 2012 Limited with every option, 4wd, auto running boards, 3rd row, 220,000 miles and an impeccable service history just sold with brand new Michelins and brand new brakes from our local dealer for $13,900. Given to a girl at graduation, she drove it from Ft Worth to Virgina Tech for college for 6 years and then lived in Ft Worth a few years till she traded it in on a Sequoia due to a growing family. Sure she racked up some miles but the service history was freaking insane, multiple trans, power steering, and diff flushes. Oil changes on the dot, wheel bearings, tires, brakes, all within normal intervals. The vehicle was well taken care of and will most likely give the new owner 5+ years of worry free driving.

 

When I was shopping a couple years ago, not a lot of 4th gens in my area, but the issue was compounded by my criteria. (no sunroof, the last couple years are pretty thin on the ground because Recession.)

For the money, I'd go lighter duty, newer, less miles since unless they enjoy off-pavement excursion, a RAV4 or CR-V will keep some of those broke college kid dollars in the books budget, the "books" budget and less age-related worries.

Also depends on their mechanical aptitude too.

Knew of a fellow student who drove his FC RX7 around and apparently rebuilt the engine annually? (or so I heard) and my (then) 20 year-old Sienna had things crop up to deal with. Was 100% reliable but plastic door handles broke, discovered power steering leak, driver's door weatherstripping dripped just a touch, etc.

Hardly big deals but fellow students made everything work so maybe not as big of a deal. (Memorable on-campus was a 2nd gen brown Taurus with the custom plate "POTATOE")

 

Both the LS 500 and LX 600 are tuned for Premium Fuel (91+) and still had/have the same issue.

There was a thought that this was LSPI and that the GTMO (Toyota Genuine Motor Oil) spec'ed at 0W-20 wasn't up to the task. Combine that with Direct Injection, LSPI can become a thing. At least in theory.

There is a 2022 Tundra owner who ran exclusively 91+ octane and they still experienced an engine seizing going 60MPH. Believe it had around 48,000 miles on it. Engine would not spin even with a 3-ft breaker bar on it.

 

There are certainly a few small changes they could make that would seemingly make it more reliable.

They will get it fixed/resolved, it just might take a little more time.

They should probably also change their additive package a little on their GTMO Synthetics due to the bearing material in both the engine and turbochargers.

 

You get a car!, you get a car!, everybody gets a car!

 

If we were allowed to tune these things, and we could see the knock detection values and potentially pull 4-6 degrees of timing in low RPM high load, boosted areas you could potentially rule this out. There are VERY few people who are going to crack into the ECU and start tuning on new vehicles for fear of voiding the warranty. Most people see tuning as a way to crank out more power, my theory is tuning to increase efficiency and reduce issues. I dont like pushing the envelope, i prefer to create a cushion of safety. I would like to see what the load, boost, and timing looks like, and i could tell you within a few minutes if its detonation. There are certain values that our crap fuel will and wont allow, and if someone with some turbo tuning looked under the skirt in the ECU tuning parameters they could likely find an issue.
Yes Toyota understands pre-ignition, detonation, knock, and knows how to prevent it. They have done excellent jobs on the TRD supercharger packages for the tacoma / 4R / Tundra / ect in the past. Once they went to the liquid to air intercooler systems for the 2007 debut of the 4.0 supercharger, things got significantly better. Their tuning on the supercharger reflashes were second to none. I know they have the ability to tune but i cant tell you why the new Tundra twin turbo v6 are having the problems.

I do suspect its the high pressure direct injection, it atomizes the fuel so small its so much easier to burn and therefore so much easier to ignite as its being sprayed into the combustion chamber due to the hotter intake air temps and higher cylinder temps. Looking at the exhaust gas temps on the new turbo vehicles is another telling item. The exhaust gas temps are significantly higher than they were just a few years ago. My thoughts are they are running the coolant temps higher, allowing for higher cylinder temps, and running the AFR leaner for higher combustion temps, coupled with multiple stages of catalytic converters and mufflers to increase exhaust gas temps to help burn any unburnt fuel in the exhaust so the catalytic converters will have enough temp to help scavenge anything out of the air. All in an attempt to create less emissions, but as a detriment to the engines longevity. Look at the water temps and thermostats being used today in a current engine, everything selling at a dealership today is 10-20 degrees hotter than it was 10-15 years ago, and 40 degrees hotter than they were 30 years ago. The manufacturers are running cars at 220 degrees water temp, and running the AFR lean i have seen WOT pulls on current NA vehicles in the 13.6 range. These numbers are not good for longevity.

 

Agree with everything you said. CAFE & Emissions rule the roost right now.

 

The problem here in New England is that’s 15+ years of rust. Those Toyota frames will be toast if it wasn’t treated yearly and not many owners do it around here. They just plan on trading in every few years.

 

Come on down to Texas and get a clean frame 2009 Limited for $9500 and drive it home.

 

I’ve talked about doing that with my son in a few years. Fly to Utah, buy a 2nd gen Tacoma and road trip it home. The difficult part is registering and insuring it in our state. They make everything difficult.

 

The drive back would be spectacular. I-80 from Utah thru Colorado over to Denver is what I consider the prettiest drive in the whole US. Doing it in late may or early June when everything is greening up below the snow line and water is running down the Colorado river next to I-80 is a breath taking sight.