Going up steep hill from full stop - new 4runner - excessive roll back -transmission issue?

Good morning all, happy early 4th! I'm hoping the team can put my fears at rest or provide some guidance on an issue I've experienced several times.

Background: New 2023 4Runner ORP with roughly 620 miles. I have a pretty steep and long driveway and often I stop at the bottom of the driveway to get the mail before I go up the driveway. The sequence of events: I put my parking brake on, place the car into park and get the mail. Once I'm back in the car, I depress the brake pedal, place the car into Drive and release the parking brake and step on the accelerator pedal.

Issue: Every time I proceed to go up the remainder of the driveway, the instant I release the brake pedal, the car rolls back, like instantly. I know this is somewhat normal in cars, although I've had vehicles in the past that had an automatic hill hold future which would prevent the car from rolling back at all. In the 4 runner, I quickly but not fully depress the gas pedal. At this point, the car makes all this noise and some lights flash in the gauge cluster and only then does the vehicle start moving forward. I tested a similar scenario where I would just come to a full stop (no parking brake or shifting the car into Park) at the place in the driveway and then attempt to proceed to go uphill and it's the same results.

Please find the video which demonstrates the issue below:

https://youtu.be/tEsvdUxsNOE

Is this issue normal, or do I need to be concerned about a transmission issue? I've never experienced anything similar to this in my previous vehicles. Thanks in advance for everyone's help!

 

Mine does it too, I think because it's heavy, so at idle the torque converter doesn't keep it from sliding back.

The noise is because it thinks you're sliding out of control.

Either give it a little gas before coming off the brake all the way, or get on the gas quicker. I had to adjust when I first got it, but haven't had the issue since.

Edit: especially if you're used to the car holding the hill for you, it may be worse for you.

 

Hi Schlappesepple! Thanks for sharing your experience and putting some of my fears at ease. It's just a weird feeling because it is a heavy car and let's say you're on a steep hill with cars behind you I feel the car will roll back and hit the car behind you if you're not aware of the lag.

 

Normal. Mine does it too. Enjoy the 4R!

 

Thanks ChessGuy!

I'm about to get ready to attend a buddy's wedding in Philadelphia today, and I am excited for the road trip. I'll have crossed the 1k mile mark when I return. I hope to share my initial ownership experience from purchasing to the current point within the next few weeks.

 

It’s normal. Brake torque it slightly - hold the brake, put it in drive, press and hold the gas a bit, release the brake.

 

I've experienced that same beeping and dash light if I've shifted into 'D' while still slightly rolling backwards from being in 'R' backing out of my driveway. As @Schlappesepple noted, the vehicle is warning of loss of traction, or some such thing.

 

That noise is the ABS being activated because the Hill Start Assist Control system is monitoring the wheel speed sensors. It knows you are rolling backwards and you are in Drive. That is an uncertain situation and it is stopping it. It’s the same noise you will hear IF you engage Crawl Control. I actually love this feature and you are getting daily proof that yours is working properly. If I stop my ORP on the street curb (front wheels near top) entering my driveway, it does the same thing when it starts to roll back down the curb. Since you ORP is new, take it to a gravel road or dirt road, engage 4 Lo, then crawl control. Especially if it is a downhill grade and you select a low speed (with crawl control selector switch) you will hear the same noises as the ABS and throttle work together to maintain the speed you selected. Once you hear these systems operating your anxiety will vanish.

 

All completely normal. Once you learn how to feather the throttle on hills, it becomes easy.

 

I experienced this for the first time yesterday. I'm surprised it took so long, because the road from my house rises on a steep curve into a T intersection. Several snowplows have wiped out descending it in my time here. Anyway, I considerable rollback starting from a dead stop at the T, and it made a terrible racket. My hypothesis was that the ABS was starting to kick in. I'll have endless opportunity for future observation, but I'll mainly pay closer attention to brake/throttle coordination.

 

What's not normal is the fact that the R&D people have taken over what us normal people have known for years and engineered nanny bots in to these electronic controlled transmissions.

At my old house in the SoCal. Mtns. my driveway was a 32* incline uphill. So I learned to drive up it accordingly.
Start it, right foot on brake, shift into D, left foot releases P brake, left foot slides to brake pedal, right foot slides to gas pedal.
No nanny noises.

On a side note regarding automatic transmissions on rocky trails. I find it funny that when drivers only use one foot instead of both feet to drive, they tend to either not bump the rock hard enough and roll back or bump it to hard, then slam down hard on the other side of the said rock. It's just an observation.

It's another reason why I love my 98:1 crawl ratio in my manual trans TJ.

 

My '22 will do it as well it's normal. As mentioned any time your in drive and it rolls backwards is not good for the trans hence the warning indicators. My driveway is also sloped and tight between houses if I let the wife out at the base of the sloped driveway I have to 2 foot the truck so it doesn't roll backwards before I move forward and trigger the warnings indicators. Better for your trans.

 

My 18 highlander’s hill assist actually holds the brakes when it senses a hill and doesn’t release it until you actually give it some gas. It permits zero roll back. I don’t like it. And it’s horrible for new drivers in training, as it removes the sense of the vehicle’s weight, and their responsibility to manage it. It also feels artificial. I’ve heard people complain about it because when you gas it, it will NOT release the brakes until the torque is exactly equal to the weight pulling it back. It feels awkward, but it does exactly what it was programmed to do…allow zero rollback.

The 4runner’s hill assist just seems to utilize the a-trac/traction control system. It sounds like stuff is getting wrecked, but it’s a reminder to use my left foot on the brake as I start climbing. It’s an old school truck made before the days of “everything assist”.

 

Yes, 5:1. And for a comparison, my '03 model is an X.
An '03 Rubicon w/automatic is (IIRC) 43:1 crawl.

 

So dumb question not to high Jack thread.

If you are at a boat ramp and about to pull your boat out of the water and have the parking brake set….would you still be able to do the two foot?

With my old Explorer I would push in the brake with left foot, shift into drive or 1st gear, slightly give some gas, then release the parking brake.

I can see this rolllback and noise scaring the crap out of me at a boat ramp

 

I would put right foot on brake pedal, release parking brake with left foot, put in drive, momentarily have both feet on brake, move right foot to gas pedal, keep left foot on brake while applying gas with right foot slowly, when you feel vehicle wanting to move forward remove left foot off brake. You should never get the ABS noise this way because the wheels will never roll backwards with transmission in D. Honestly once you hear the ABS engage a few times from the Hillstart Assist system I don’t think you will ever be alarmed again.

 

Thanks makes sense. You can tell how many times I have done this with 4R. My old Explorer had a lever to pull for the e brake as opposed to the foot lever on the 4R lol. Appreciate the tip I screen shot and saved this

 

You can also do the same thing you did with the Explorer, just release the parking brake with your foot.

Mike's suggestion is better, though, as the regular brakes will hold the car better than just the parking brake.

 

Thanks Guys appreciate the tips. I will probably practice it in driveway with boat also before I go. Sadly due to some health issues not getting boat probably this year again from storage. So I dream of the boating and out west trips with the 4R through you guys for the moment. Thanks again

 

This is a common feature on most new cars called brake hold assist or something along those lines. Basically, you push the brake pedal all the way to the floor and it will keep the brake activated after you release. You just push on the gas pedal to disengage the brake and move forward. This would be an amazing feature on the 4Runner but will probably only be available in the 6th gen and newer models.

 

Hope you are feeling better and up to getting that boat out on the water soon!

 

It came with the TJ when I won it.
It's stupid slow but so cool to crawl with.

 

I had a concerning clunk this evening. 600 miles on the ORP and I was in two-wheel drive. Went up a very steep driveway to a parking structure and I'm hoping it was the hill assist. It was like somebody hit the underside with an aluminum bat. My first thought was the transmission, but I can also see where the brakes might have been clamping when I tried to hit the gas a little harder. I did not experience any rolling backwards, so not the transmission getting beaten into submission.

 

Just wanted to pile on with a “normal” response. same thing happens in our 2019 on steep hills.

 

98:1?

Rookie numbers

 

My driveway is at a decent grade as well. Might be because I've driven manuals (with no nanny brake hold) for so many years, but even in autos I've still done right foot on brake, left foot release parking brake, swap left foot to brake, right foot gas, then release brake. My Camry with the electronic parking brake makes this dance pretty seamless since it lets go as soon as you put it in drive.

 

It will do the same thing if, while reversing, you put the transmission into Drive while still rolling backward. I've done this a few times when in a hurry - and exactly what the above video shows happens.

 

Mine does it too, i have a steep driveway, I can adjust for it, but I don’t like it.

 

Thing is, this is my second TRD Off-Road and the first one would go up the same driveway with no problems at all same driving patterns, it's off of a busy intersection, so I always have a decent rolling head start and go up slowly just in case some idiot tourist shoots down on the wrong side of the lane.

Electronic parking brakes are another reason why I didn't buy the new RAV4s for my kids. Give me a six-speed and a handbrake!

 

mins does it too when in downtown SF.. i just dislike hearing that sound..