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Removing braces for skid plates?

Discussion in 'Armor' started by Gamma Ray, Mar 14, 2021.

  1. Mar 14, 2021 at 11:05 AM
    #1
    Gamma Ray

    Gamma Ray [OP] Be excellent to each other

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    Who cares? This never shows everything anyway.
    I was watching this video last night from Victory 4X4 about their install of the Victory 4X4 skid plates.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8JLF9z_18SY

    I saw that they removed some parts that they called crash bars and another thing they referred to as braces of some sort. They put the skid plates on after removing those parts, but those parts remained off.

    Is keeping those parts off really a good thing? They look like they're rather sturdy things that would provide structure for the vehicle, and I'm not sure if the skid plates would be good replacements for those parts. I've got to wonder if skid plates that go on over these parts would be better for the vehicle in the long term.

    I'm reminded of these cracks in the wheelwells that I've seen people have. Perhaps there's a correlation between removing these parts and a stretching of the wheelwell to the point of cracking? And if not this, then maybe something else?
     
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  2. Mar 14, 2021 at 11:09 AM
    #2
    Thatbassguy

    Thatbassguy New member? Really??

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    I had to remove some of those things to install my skid plates. I'm not certain the the skid plates are quite as strong as the braces we removed, but I felt confident enough to do so. I haven't noticed any issues yet. The skid plates did bolt into the holes those parts had been bolted into, IIRC.
     
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  3. Mar 14, 2021 at 11:30 AM
    #3
    Moon Landing

    Moon Landing AFFTC 1967/68 Eddies Air Patch

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    Hmm? Could easily be seen as a trade-off between crashing and/or bashing? :notsure:
     
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  4. Mar 14, 2021 at 7:31 PM
    #4
    POWERPLANTHOMER

    POWERPLANTHOMER New Member

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    I have the RCI full skid package on my 2021 with KDSS, I went with RCI for this fact, I did t want to remove any factory frame supports. Just my opinion only.
     
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  5. Mar 14, 2021 at 7:42 PM
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    kmeeg

    kmeeg LionRunner

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    Yep, I got RCI on my TRD ORP with no KDSS and didn't remove any crash bars or any brackets. Just removed old ones and fixed RCI ones;

    https://youtu.be/rzoY7ilUxDQ
     
  6. Mar 14, 2021 at 7:46 PM
    #6
    SlvrSlug

    SlvrSlug Slightly bent.

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    I have also been noticing that some skids have stiffeners welded in and supporting posts, and some have nothing. This also could help keeping things from tweaking.
     
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  7. Mar 14, 2021 at 7:56 PM
    #7
    DrewMan

    DrewMan 2016 4RTP-KDSS

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    So thankful you posted this question, because I too watched this vid but it was several months back in search for replacement skids and I just didn’t like the idea of removing something structural that was meant to be there for extra safety members during a crash. I’ve narrowed down my research to purchase RCI Skids in raw aluminum since my 4RTP is KDSS equipped.
    Thanks
     
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  8. Mar 14, 2021 at 7:58 PM
    #8
    POWERPLANTHOMER

    POWERPLANTHOMER New Member

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    I have been very happy with my skids, they helped out today with the deep snow drifts in Colorado by the way.

    BADEC2CB-104E-42CA-ADA7-47B73656067D.jpg
    26C7CD26-F81A-484C-9EC6-74E0BC0C08D3.jpg
     
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  9. Mar 14, 2021 at 8:19 PM
    #9
    Reldn

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    That's what settled me on the RCI skids as well. I was originally looking at Victory, but, after watching that video the thought of removing those crash bars/frame supports just didn't sit right with me.
     
  10. Mar 14, 2021 at 8:47 PM
    #10
    DRH

    DRH TRD Broverlander Extraordinaire

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    I also did the full RCI aluminum skids. You lose just a bit of clearance keeping the frame members. But you don't have to shim anything down further with a 1" diif drop as it clears the plates with them bolted up flush.
     
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  11. Mar 14, 2021 at 9:18 PM
    #11
    SlvrSlug

    SlvrSlug Slightly bent.

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    I do like the RCI skids, but after looking around a bit, in my opinion this is the best skid structurally that i have seen for a aluminum skid. Look at the bracing, and the jacking point. I purchased a skid and i am kicking myself in the ass since i got it, i am going to remove it, and hang it on the garage wall as a reminder to research a bit better before purchasing. I am showing you the top side because that is what we should be looking at, again just my opinion.

    FA84F9AF-156F-45C8-9B65-91707C12B2D4.jpg
     
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  12. Mar 14, 2021 at 9:24 PM
    #12
    NotaTRD

    NotaTRD It’s my wife’s 4R, she just lets me drive it

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    No need to remove the crash bar or brackets for the LFD front skid plate either. Some front skid plates require it and others don’t. I haven’t seen any crash test data comparisons with them on vs with them off to really come to a firm conclusion, but leaving them in place can’t be a bad thing.
     
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  13. Mar 14, 2021 at 9:28 PM
    #13
    NotaTRD

    NotaTRD It’s my wife’s 4R, she just lets me drive it

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    Who makes the skid plate pictured?
     
  14. Mar 14, 2021 at 9:51 PM
    #14
    SlvrSlug

    SlvrSlug Slightly bent.

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  15. Mar 15, 2021 at 6:12 AM
    #15
    Todi

    Todi New Member

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  16. Mar 15, 2021 at 8:55 AM
    #16
    can0nfan2379

    can0nfan2379 New Member

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    So looking at the first picture it doesn't look like the braces hang down any lower than where the skids are mounting at, so do the skids that have you remove the braces somehow gain more clearance or are they simply wider covering more of the undercarriage?

    I was actually looking at C4 Fab's skid plate package but couldn't find an answer about the braces on their website so may just email them and ask.
     
  17. Mar 15, 2021 at 9:17 AM
    #17
    kbp810

    kbp810 rebmem wen

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    I wouldn't worry too much about removing those two front braces; there is not much substance to them. They hardly weigh anything at all, so couldn't imagine that they provide much of any structural support. I'd imagine that they're more so for just deflecting things downward in the even of a crash, or helping to provide backup support to the thin stock skids; but any good after market skid is going to already do a better job of this.

    I just installed a set of Victory skids, and had zero hesitations about removing them.
     
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  18. Mar 15, 2021 at 9:44 AM
    #18
    koukimonster

    koukimonster DYNO4

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    Hmm I could see the front "braces" being replaced in a way with a stronger skid, so those probably aren't a huge deal IMO (just a guess). That said, I would definitely not want to remove those reward braces, personally. It may not be a huge deal, but surely those are tightening up the body and overall feel of the truck.

    Does anyone know if any of these braces must be removed for CBI, Hefty Fab, or Greenlane aluminum skids?
     
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  19. Mar 15, 2021 at 10:03 AM
    #19
    kbp810

    kbp810 rebmem wen

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    It was explained to me before that the bars from frame to cross member was just a sort of skid for the cat's. Like the front bars, they're also pretty light weight, and one of mine already had a pretty good sized dent in it. I don't think they're doing anything for suspension, as I don't think the frame would really flex in this area, or that the bars would prevent much of any flex even if it was. If a skid works with retaining those bars, I certainly wouldn't see it as a bad thing for keeping them (other than perhaps that they do hang a little low), but like the front bars, I don't really see any issues with losing them (assuming that new skid will also protect the cats).
     
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  20. Mar 15, 2021 at 11:22 AM
    #20
    koukimonster

    koukimonster DYNO4

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    Appreciate your thoughts. Since I am only looking at replacing the engine skid for now, I suppose those rear braces won't come into play for my project. Forgive me, took me a minute to realize that. Regarding the front braces, it appears that Hefty Fab's old skid retained those braces.. however they've apparently redesigned their front skid, so now I'm not sure. I'll probably give them a call since I am considering their skid for my 4Runner. I don't think it's a big issue, but I would like to retain the OE as much as possible. I am sure Toyota wouldn't spend any money they didn't feel compelled to...

    EDIT: Per Hefty Fab installation instructions, their redesigned skid does require removal of the front braces.
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2021
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  21. Mar 16, 2021 at 12:31 PM
    #21
    koukimonster

    koukimonster DYNO4

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    Just wanted to update this thread with some new info I've found while researching.

    The rear braces are called "frame crossmember brackets" by Toyota, FWIW.

    The front braces are called "chassis frame reinforcement." It seems that some aftermarket skids require removal of these, and some do not. When fitting the TRD Pro skid plate (at least to a vehicle it is compatible with, i.e. non-KDSS equipped), these braces stay in place.

    Interestingly, there is indeed a different part number for these for KDSS equipped runners. Serious Googling dug me up some pics where you can see that the KDSS parts curve and hang down lower than the non-KDSS parts.. which makes sense because the KDSS bars/mounts move up and down, whereas the non-KDSS sway bars are fixed. These braces sit below the sway bar, so the KDSS version must hang lower to allow for bar articulation in that area.

    Finally starting to understand why some of these skids look so different, etc...

    At least, this says to me that a skid designed for *both* KDSS and non-KDSS would be less than ideal on a non-KDSS 4Runner, because if the skid is shaped in a way to accomodate the KDSS braces, it's angle will be more extreme and less "flat" than it could be, which would mean better aero, sliding, and clearance. Also, it seems that most KDSS skids have less side coverage, which makes sense because they need area cut out for sway bar movement in that area.

    Non-KDSS part:
    [​IMG]

    KDSS part:
    https://baza.drom.ru/novosibirsk/se...shity-dvigatelja-lexus-gx460-g5986265617.html
    [​IMG]

    Also, I discovered that the KDSS vehicles have a different front skid aka "radiator" skid..
    [​IMG]

    It is baffling to me that this is the first time I've read this on a 4Runner forum despite the hundreds of skid plate threads.
     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2021
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  22. Mar 16, 2021 at 1:58 PM
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    SlvrSlug

    SlvrSlug Slightly bent.

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    https://mountainoffroad.com/collections/toyota-4runner/products/front-skid-plate-for-toyota-4runner-gen-5-aluminum
    i am really kind of impressed with M.O.R.E.s skid plates, not only are they beefy, it looks like they retain the brackets that we are talking about. The price for the aluminum skids almost gave me a heart attack, the steel ones are about half the cost. If you go to the installation page you can see what I’m talking about on the brackets. I like what i see, but i would have to pony up for the aluminum because i want the weight saving, and i am not a rock crawler. Look at the bottom of the page for install.
     
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  23. Mar 16, 2021 at 3:24 PM
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    glwood54

    glwood54 Stop making me buy stuff!

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    Great video...but you need to invest in a rechargeable impact wrench...
     
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  24. Mar 16, 2021 at 4:10 PM
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    kmeeg

    kmeeg LionRunner

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    I thought about it but kept on postponing. Is impact wrench and impact driver same thing? (I have no idea on tools)
    I want to buy something that can put in a screw in to the wood or wall without messing the head? That's the most needed for my home than for car work (since I don't do serious work on cars..LoL). I have a drill that screw-up the screws all the time.. LoL.
     
  25. Mar 17, 2021 at 7:38 AM
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    koukimonster

    koukimonster DYNO4

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    I agree. These are starting to look like the best Al option for me. I'm not 100% sure on the jack pad not denting the cross-member with that design, but it's probably fine. And considering that the shipping is included in the price, it isn't TOO bad compared to the competition. My biggest issue with it is their logo on the front. I hate to rub them the wrong way if/when I ask them to ship me one sans logo.. :oops:
     
  26. Mar 17, 2021 at 7:43 AM
    #26
    SlvrSlug

    SlvrSlug Slightly bent.

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    Yes, i agree with that logo, it at the very least could be much smaller, but i would ask to not have it.
     
  27. Mar 20, 2021 at 12:36 AM
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    POWERPLANTHOMER

    POWERPLANTHOMER New Member

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    I have KDSS, so my front skid is a little different than the non KDSS, I’m pretty sure that the front portion on the KDSS holds the flat profile longer than the non. It looks a little different from the front. I actually didn’t have their install instructions when I was bolting mine up.

    833E9CAD-DAE1-41BD-B2DA-B83D7F8FC977.jpg
    61A08F6E-8D2A-4F2F-8915-CD48B8182B75.jpg
     
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