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Towing 4,000lbs on steep grades

Discussion in 'Towing' started by dcgarcia5, Nov 9, 2020.

  1. Dec 5, 2020 at 6:53 AM
    #31
    Pgh18Gen5

    Pgh18Gen5 New Member

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    Tacoma trans cooler / Scangauge II monitor
    Ive been towing with a 2018 limited for more than a year with 2400 to 4800 lbms and 3 suggestions. Staying out of overdrive is important. I run a scangauge ii and monitor trans temp and with a tacoma cooler i added trans runs 190F in od and 170F in s4. Sure od is fine about. 5% of time in pa but id rather run 60 mph or say 3000 rpm with a cool trans. If you rent uhaul and it has surge brake and does not have electric brakes, going downhill is worst and you can not manually apply trailer brake to straighten out the rig if you start swaying. Without trans cooler, going uphill in s3 at 3500 rpm, i bet trans temp exceeds 230F, where normal trans temp is 165F not towing. Read about trans fluid temps in an oil forum sometime. I drive by trans temp every time i tow, but then i have a lifetime drivetrain warranty but dont like it needing fixed. I put on 2018 tacoma cooler and almost a direct boltup. Id never tow 4000 without a cooler but if you do, change trans fluid at 50k miles. Private message me and we can talk if you like. Ive towed for years and love the 4R as long as you set it up right, its a perfect tow vehicle to 5000 lbm. I regularly tow 4800 toy hauler with polaris rzr and check tongue weight every trip to be 10 to 15%. I dont use a weight distributing hitch but 500 tongue weight drops rear from 36 inch to 34.5 inch and its ok. You also require brakes over 1650 lbm by manual or insurance could claim you violated towing linits.
     
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2020
    BGB_SharkDiver likes this.
  2. Dec 5, 2020 at 6:59 AM
    #32
    trdrunner2020

    trdrunner2020 @trdrunner2020

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    I've tried to find this in the manual. But does anyone know the limits of each gear as far as rpm and mph when using sequential mode? Like the upper and lower range levels to not cause damage to engine or transmission. Thanks
     
  3. Dec 5, 2020 at 7:24 AM
    #33
    Pgh18Gen5

    Pgh18Gen5 New Member

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    Tacoma trans cooler / Scangauge II monitor
    Control it by engine rpm just like if you were driving a manual trans. Ive driven for hours at 3000 rpm in s4 towing and gotten to 4000 or more for a bit uphill in lower gears. Again, i drive by trans temp towing, but drive within engine rpm range limits and not super highs revs any more than any other car. My rule is try to drive less than 50% of max rpms for engine longevity. That said i just had a crisis run for an energency in the middle of this post and was at really high revs for 15 min to get somwehere fast, and engine is fine, and crisis worked out fine...

    Heres an easy analogy. A 4R is the most likely suv to reach 300k miles from what i read, which is why i bought it. So 70 mph at 2200 rpm with trans at 165F at maybe 100 hp if i recall my scangauge ii right and it is happy. So now you run at 4000 rpm more ofyen and say 185 hp, you are working engine harder, hotter firing in cylinders and more stress on rods and bearings and valves and ring compression. Still lasts but maybe only 200k before repairs. You run near redline at high rpms a lot more, close to 240 hp and components are stressed way more, then youre likely to be doing repairs at 150k miles or much less. The 4R can take what you dish out, but the harder you run it the sooner something will give you a problem. But it can take spirited driving better than almost any other vehicle, althoygh i read that the u.s. toyota engines have stronger connecting rods than those made in japan in a post once. But 4R is not a u.s. engine. Good luck. It is a great vehicle and will be better however you drive than any other. As a data point, i blew the engine on a used 2013 bmw x5 5.0 at 55k miles after i just got it with only a handful of trips from spirited driving and towing of my atvs, and it was almost twice the cost of a 4R new. So enjoy your 4R. I love mine.
     
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2020
  4. Dec 5, 2020 at 1:12 PM
    #34
    mac1usa

    mac1usa New Member

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    All this is a learning curve for me. For years I towed a 3,500lb boat (all in weight) with a 90s Explorer with 4.0V6 and 3.73 rear axle with a tow package. I believe that tow package included a beefed up trans cooler.

    I am outside Detroit so it’s flat here, no hills. I have the old school column shift. So it’s drive or overdrive. I never used the overdrive when towing.

    I would not even know where to go or who to trust to put in a trans cooler. I have been debating 4R which was first choice. Or a Taco or GMC Canyon. I like the SUV option much better and like the reviews on it more
     
  5. Dec 5, 2020 at 4:28 PM
    #35
    Pgh18Gen5

    Pgh18Gen5 New Member

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    Tacoma trans cooler / Scangauge II monitor
    The same yr tacoma cooler is almost a direct bolt up except trim plastic on drivers side and install a 2 inch bracket on that end. Run 2 hoses down to bottom of radiator with shield plate off like for an oil change. Cooler was 230 at a dealer. Id definitely get the 4R over the other two. Total install time was 3 hrs maybe. Get the scangauge ii and program for trans temp. Tow by it my opinion. Id check and find a trusted toyota non dealer garage for install. Private message me and we can talk if you like and figure out a path. Its not so hard honestly with a bit of homework.

    I towed a 5000 lbm coachman 24 ft twin bunk with a 94 explorer all over u.s. thermostat out when towing, 4.0, 3.73, towing pkg with cooler. Ran it to 215k. Then towed it with 03 yukon denali 6.0 after that.

    Get the 4R and get a cooler and youll be great. Even on level out of OD, in summer trans runs too hot if cycling in and out of lockup in my opinion. Good luck.
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2020
  6. Jan 7, 2021 at 10:14 PM
    #36
    4x4Runnerr

    4x4Runnerr New Member

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    What are anyone's thoughts about towing another car with a total weight may be around 5500-6000 lbs including the car and the trailer. It won't be too often, but when I do, probably about 400 miles one way and possibly cross country (this may only be once or twice). Do you think it'll do just as stock, or are modifications going to be necessary? Just bought my first 4R and thought it would be a good mix of a family truck plus tow vehicle. Thanks!
     
  7. Jan 7, 2021 at 10:41 PM
    #37
    GrantA

    GrantA Enjoying God’s creation

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    The vehicle has a max tow rating of 5000lb (assuming you have the v6 and not the older v8 model). Can the 4Runner do it, yes. Should you do it, NO... But let me leave you with a scenario...

    Your driving this trailer, you hit something in the road, trailer tire pops or your 4runner tire pops, you can’t stop or lose control, you hit something or someone, insurance gets involved, they find out you didn’t follow the manufactures specs. You are going to be held liable for that. Ignorance won’t work either. So will it work, yes the 4Runner can do it. Should you??? No it would be unwise to say so.
     
    Trail Runnah, Toy4X4 and Thatbassguy like this.
  8. Jan 8, 2021 at 6:24 AM
    #38
    4x4Runnerr

    4x4Runnerr New Member

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    Thanks for the explanation! It's a 5th gen 2021 4R. Now if the weight limit was just within the 5000lbs. Would the stock set up do it?
     
  9. Jan 8, 2021 at 7:05 AM
    #39
    GrantA

    GrantA Enjoying God’s creation

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    There is a standard rule of thumb when towing. Try and keep your towing weight at no more than 80% of the max towing capacity. Can you do more? Yes as long as your load is under 5k pounds, you don’t exceed your vehicles payload capacity, and your hitch weight doesn’t exceed your vehicles capacity you should be fine. Would I recommend it, no.

    If you are primarily on flat surfaces you should be fine getting close to max. Make sure you have a brake controller on your vehicle if you don’t. Those brake controllers make a huge difference.

    Personal story: I had a pop up camper (~3800-4K pounds) that I pulled up the mountains from Phoenix, AZ (1,086 feet above sea level) to Flagstaff, AZ (6,909 feet above sea level) in the summer time (110+ degrees outside). I don’t have a transmission thermostat but took it slow and tried not to exceed 3k rpms but some of those grades were really steep and I had to get the rpms up because I started slowing down in the 50 mph range. This vehicle is definitely not like the Tundra I had. With my Tundra I wouldn’t have even known the load was behind me that is how great the Tundra was. However with the 4Runner it felt like I was crawling and had to just take it slow. Could I have floored it and kept going and been fine? Yes but I know that is not what was best for my 4Runner so I didn’t.
    B33544F3-A013-4A4E-B40A-9F2A583BF543.jpg
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2021
  10. Jan 8, 2021 at 7:14 AM
    #40
    4x4Runnerr

    4x4Runnerr New Member

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    Thanks again GrantA!
     
    GrantA[QUOTED] likes this.
  11. Jan 8, 2021 at 9:22 AM
    #41
    borellar15

    borellar15 New Member

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    I just towed my travel trailer 21’ 3400lb dry to Utah from Texas. We went on the national parks trip for Christmas. I do use weight distributing hitch and sway control bar and also have airbag helpers installed in rear coil springs that I inflate to 28.5 psi. Trip was a breeze. As stated above S4 the whole way tried to stay around 2500-3000 rpms for the most part no problem. Don’t have a transmission cooler but it performed great even up steeper grades and twisting roads etc. Proud of the runner. Biggest problem was trying my aching calf muscles from holding the gas pedal down the whole time since no cc!

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    7A95FB2A-7443-4385-8ED3-CAF47AAF9D57.jpg
     
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