Potential new owner. Toyota safety sense or no?

I'm keeping my 2019. TSS stuff is just a bunch more things that will eventually break. Besides, I drive the old fashioned way - I pay attention.

 

The emergency braking has only activated in dicey situations but I've bumped down the sensitivity. I'd say it's good and worst case helps me drive a little more defensively.

The land-departure alert would be useful only on long fatiguing trips and if you turn it off, it's gone forever until you turn it back on.

The adaptive cruise is nice to have but I'm finding myself using standard cruise maybe half the time.

The other perks of the 2020+ changes like stock CarPlay and tire pressure readout is nice but I could certainly live without TSS-P.

I don't have rear-cross-traffic alert (RCTA) or blind-spot monitoring, I specifically wanted to skip those but I do see the appeal of RCTA.

 

I know this sounds silly, but I still drive with my eyes open and I'm driving when I'm driving. I don't care for nanny systems and bought used older to stay away from technology problems. They use to test more throughly on Lexus before implementing on Toyotas. Platform sharing and production problems along with environmental issues are pushing them faster than they used to go.

 

I could see having that, but the auto braking integrated with cruise could be a problem. I still am old school scanning mirrors and being alert. If anyone can get run over it will most likely be me

 

The lane departure goes of on me at times but it’s usually when I exit on an off-ramp and don’t signal like I should have so that’s on me.

The collision alert has also gone off on me before but it was my fault again for not slowing down soon enough and it did trigger me to hit the brakes harder.

I scratch my head on those that claim the collision alert is going off all the time for “No Reason”. The system is randomly bad on different models or we have lots of people that think they are better drivers than they really are. Personally I think we have lots of people that drive like shit but are oblivious to it.

 

I hear you. I get tired of meeting people in a curve on my side of the road. I think people are doing everything but driving. Everyone thinks it's a right and they know how to drive. Amazon probably selling driver's licenses now just answer these 3 simple questions for them. I'm not as worried in a 4runner but in my corolla I put a camera to record accidents. I usually get hit by people with no insurance, but they will buy it if it's their fault. I spot women drivers by driving style usually. Cluelessly riding my ass

 

It's not a braking feature on adaptive cruise control but keeping a safe distance when the car in front is incapable of maintaining a steady speed. It comes into its own on busy 2 lane highways. I use it all the time but do not rely on it to stop me when the car in front stops or slows abruptly.

It takes a lot of stress out of driving on the types of roads I drive where a 20 mile drive will encounters 6 or more different speed zones.

No way would I ever live in a Large city.

 

Yes I personally wouldn't want it. I have always been good at judging speed and following distance after the military. I drive rural roads and interstate mostly. A little around town. I couldn't stand stop and go city either. I practice driving and trying not to use my brakes especially if you drive same road all the time. The red lights are all on sensors so you can tell by traffic when they will change.

 

I didn't think mine had ABS until I broke skid wires and light came on. I must say my AWD has activated and saved me several times kicking in. It's like a really good dog, it knows what you're doing, when you changed your mind and has a plan before I know what's going on. I'm pretty impressed how well Limited with Xreas holds a curve. Almost scary and only limited by amount of rubber available. I wouldn't mind an overland Sienna AWD.

 

How does software break?

Even if it does, since you don't want it and have the option of turning it off, how would it "breaking" affect the use of your 4Runner?

 

ABS has been mandatory on all US sold passenger cars since 2012 (NHTSA rules) . Toyota has been putting in everything they sell a lot longer than that.

I was iffy on the other aids in TSS2.0 as some of the nanny systems can cause more annoyance than anything else, but I have to say I've been very pleasantly suprised with my '23. The adaptive radar cruise control actually works really well and you can just set it and forget it and drive though traffic and it maintains the spacing well. The pre-collision stuff I have had beep at me and preload the breaks a couple times in situations that I would have soiled my paints if it wasnt there (legitimate I got distracted or the guy in front panic stopped without warning). Other than that it really sint noticeable at all.


I have been driving since before airbags and rear seat shoulder belts and honestly I don't see anything bad in most of this advanced safety stuff - Ive got family who survived crashes without a scrape that would have killed somebody in the 70s.

 

I hauled cattle in the southern Midwest over 2 lane hilly, twisty, turning highways. Pulled a 43' "possum belly cattle trailer with a 400 Cummins backed by 13 speed Roadranger transmissions. (3 different COE Peterbilt's) I think I know how to judge speed and following distance and drive without using my brakes. It's the idiots in front of me that don't know how to drive without constantly varying their speed and getting on their brakes that are the problem.

Adaptive cruise control is a nice feature if one knows how to use it.

 

That's exactly right. It's the other person. You have to drive 2 vehicles because you know they are going to do something stupid. When I drove a truck or hauling and you're trying to keep following distance, they cut you off for a left turn. Apparently that 2 seconds is worth more than a life. I wasn't implying you couldn't drive, we who are have to watch out for everyone else.

 

ABS, VSC, AWD are all related to each other and it starts with feedback from skid wires. When I was setting up my springs and struts I left the control arm drop down to much replacing UCAs and broke the wire. It must be small because I did it 3 times on each side and broke it on inside somewhere. ABS, VSC, transfer lock light all on until I replaced. Just one of those hard lessons not paying attention. I had climate control panel go bad on 2001 and it was $550. Used to be $1100 but made in Thailand now I believe.

 

There is more than just software - and I think you know that. And there are plenty of examples of poorly written software causing problems, or even deaths. Think of Tesla and it's early autopilot.

I'm not sure all of it can be turned off. Since my T4R is pre TSS, I don't know the answer to that. I made my purchase decision and I am happy with it. I also didn't want to eat the cost of TSS added to the price of the vehicle. I am old enough that I can make my 2015 Tacoma and 2019 T4R last and likely never have to purchase another vehicle assuming neither is destroyed in a crash.

 

Yeah I would keep that Tacoma. I bought and am happy with my buy. Electronic components go bad, I have never really seen software go bad just updated. When we first got a 2nd generation Prius in to work on, Toyota sent 2 Japanese guys with a laptop and we were instructed to stay away from them and not be looking at their laptop and software. Kinda stingy

 

It's not the software (even though I normally would start complaining about auto manufacturer coding) the chief worries are the extra sensors (radar rectangle and camera) bumping up repair costs. (including a calibration technically being required for new windshield)

or if they go wrong (like my Sorento's backup sensors) it's not clear how exactly the system would handle that failure. It could fail unobtrusively, throw a light and message which would be reasonable, then fallback to standard cruise or maybe the car will throw a fit and beep whenever the cruise button was pressed.

Whether we'll seen any TSS-P bits fail is something we'll have to see in the years ahead since it's not like they depend on moving parts. I don't think we've seen an epidemic of these going south in Lexus land that's had it sooner yet.

 

I'm just trying to point out that adaptive cruise control helps keeping a safe distance from those in front without constantly making adjustments and having to reactivate cruise control after applying brakes to maintain a safe distance. State Route 56 is a horrible road to travel when there is any traffic present. Very few passing opportunities and constantly fluctuating speed zones. Not to mention clueless drivers. It is the main artery from Massena, NY on the St Lawrence River to all points south. Where I used to stalk those in front of me for opportunities to pass so I could have clear road ahead to drive a constant speed, I now relax and let the ACC make my drive more pleasant and stress free.

 

And the Luddites claimed the same thing about electronic ignition and fuel injection at one time. Is points ignition and carburetors superior to electronic software controlled systems because it can be repaired easily (as it constantly needs) Some people would say yes, but where would we be without software controlling every parameter of the operation of our vastly superior modern vehicles?

 

Yes I get that but I don't miss something I haven't had. Mine is throwing codes for cat and MAF now after running really low on fuel and I'm learning as I go. I came from 3rd gen to 5th and it's been a learning curve with more tech. Used to you could rebuild starters and alternators but I think it's all parts replacement at dealership now. The steering rack bushings seem to go bad on newer ones now. I been replacing everything with polyurethane as I go. My last 4runner only thing I replaced was passenger inner tie rod on it at 225k also and I went 300k+.

 

Well I opted for the TRD ORP for the manual transfer case and nicer interior. I drove 500 miles to get my 2021 not realizing these TSS features were included as well as optional KDSS were on the vehicle. Now that I have them, I am very pleased with all of it. Especially the KDSS.

 

I like fuel injection and no points. No distributor means you better have a good battery. My first distributorless car in 1988 had a stick and I didn't think about it until I tried to push it off to jump it. No fire no go. There's something to fix on everything but unlike domestic you usually aren't replacing a transmission or engine. I couldn't understand why Dodge had 5 different transmissions at one time and none of them were any good until now because I drove Dodge trucks to. I don't need much tech. I got mesmerized by back up camera when I first got it and wrecked bumper cover.

 

You know they have so many models now I don't know what options there are

 

That's funny, I had a 2010 Corolla that had a battery drain issue and since it was a 5-speed, on more than one occasion I was able to bump start it.

 

I haven't done what you have but I learned to drive on a stick shift car with a carubreted 70hp engine (1982 Honda) that had no electronic anything - no stability control, no traction control, no ABS. It didn't have crumple zones. It didn't have airbags. It didn't even have rear seat shoulder belts, a third brake light or a passenger side mirror.

The thing a lot of folks who are afraid of modern safety systems dont consider is that:

A - There where a lot less cars on the roads back then (the US population has increased almost 100million since I got my drivers license and I'm not THAT old)
B - Drivers didn't have all the distractions they have today. No cell phones. No screen in the car of any kind. No GPS. Not even a CD player

No matter how accomplished a driver you are these systems may still save your ass when today's younger less experienced drivers do what young inexperienced people are good at doing - dumb, un-expected things.

 

I remember those days. You couldn't pay me to go back to carburettors and breaker points for a daily driver ( a classic/project fun car is another story) Heck I haven't touched a timing light since the 1990s.

I remember my first few cars.

#1 was an 82 Honda. Carbureted and it had a distributor but pretty sure it had an electronic ignition module on it, no points and condenser. Most of my mechanic skills I learned from my dad working on it - tune ups, oil changes, brake replacements. We even had to replace struts to pass inspection once and put a new clutch in it. But the thing that really drove us nuts was it develop carburetor trouble (flooding stall) around 150-160k and there was so much emission stuff and vacuum controls on it that you pretty much had to let the dealer deal with it... they had special equipment to adjust it.

I looked around the web and found this photo of the vacuum diagram sticker inside the hood to give you an idea..



Car #2 was an 87 Dodge charger with 240k I bought for $200 (no joke) That was a big step back but the Honda had rusted out beyond economical repair I was a poor student and I needed something cheap. What a POS.. solid rotor unventilated disk brakes... back to a 4 speed rubbery shifter. It was a typical Chysler iron block slant 4, still carbureted but it had some sort of electronic (not vacuum) system that auto adjusted the carb. Somebody above said "have a good battery for electronic ignition and EFI? B---S---- this thing was murder on batteries. It was so freaking hard to start in cold weather that I went though a starter ever year I think and you damn well made sure to have a good strong charged battery in winter.


#3 was the winner. Again very used but this time an 87 Honda. Now we had fully electronic ignition (I don't think it was coil on plug yet but definitely all electronic) and PGM-FI electronic fuel injection. Pure heaven. No setting the choke.... no pumping the gas... No waiting 5 minutes for it to warm up so it didn't stall when you got moving. Just turn the key for 3-5 seconds and she fired right up any season of the year. We take this for granted today but it was an amazing advance at that time.

 

Is the TSS what makes replacing the windshield so fucking expensive? If so I would have rather not had it. AZ is literally the worst state I've ever lived in when it comes to chipped windshields. I swear I get hit by something every other day. Currently sitting with about 8 chips on the windshield this time and waiting for one to spider web before I replace it because of cost (if you want oem glass)

 

I bought a 1974 Norton 850 Commando MK II a few year back.



It still has carburetors (2) but they are very basic. I have disconnected the chokes and tickle the Amal carb to start it. It has electronic ignition a solid state rectifier/regulator from a Polaris UTV and all LED lighting. The old girl is solidly reliable.

 

There is no deductible on auto glass in most states by law so the cost of replacing the windshield is of no cost unless you are driving W/O collision or comp insurance.

Seeing as how you are driving a 2021 TRD Of Road, that would be very foolish.

Some slight pressure on the inside near the spider crack will open it up so you can get a replacement, not a repair.

 

Beat me to it... insurance should cover the glass....