Is there a TSB for the needle bearing on 2021's?

IF you recall, I purchased a new '22 SR5P in November, took it back the following day with the noise. It stayed at Harr Toyota in Worcester, MA for 11 days while they wanted to replace the driveshaft and other things before the front diff. After many calls to Toyota to intervene they finally replace the front diff. Noise gone but dent in drivers door. Yes they fixed it but didn't tell me about it until I found it and went to leave. Well now with 2500 miles on it, the noise is back! Not bringing back to the hacks at Harr Toyota, ordered an ECGS bushing and having it installed. I bought a Toyota for reliability but that is going the way of the supply chain these days I guess. Not happy with Toyota these days.

 

well. Damn. You just sealed a decision I made a couple weeks ago. Sorry about your troubles.

 

I cant hear anything on mine yet (2020 18k miles) but out of curiosity let's assume the noise starts tomorrow and it's the needle bearing. If I get the EGCS and replace it myself or have it replaced next month it's good to go and diff does not need to be replaced right?
I just want to be ready since all dealers around here are all aholes and no way they will agree to replace the diff since my car is "modified with unapproved parts" lol. Already heard that line when against my better judgement I took my car in to have the tie rod end replaced .
It will be cheaper for me just to replace it with EGCS vs driving from dealer to dealer and arguing with them.

 

Yes that is how I understand it. No need to replace front diff, just needle bearing with bushing.

 

If it makes you feel any better, Toyota has been reliably manufacturing 4runners with problem needle bearings, for at least 10 years, across both the 4runners and Tacoma lines.

Unfortunately this particular problem is not a recent development.

 

you have absolutly no idea what you are talking about. its happening to alot of people including my mom yes its off the lot. multiple forums on this site about it. its the needle bearing

 

I'm going through the same process on my 2020 ORP as well. Luckily the dealership heard the noise when I took it in for new tires last spring. They said bring it back when the sound gets worse (mainly heard around 30-40 mph originally). The rotational vibration noise from front driver side is more consistently noticeable now and the last few snow storms gave further proof the noise goes away when in 4WD. My rig is back at the stealership and they had to do a troubleshooting session with their tech support. The service advisor communicated it was a "failed front differential", but the reality is it's the needle bearing. Fingers crossed they get the new diff installed correctly.
This thread was a great reference...thanks everyone

 

Hope people can share your enthusiasm. Someone made an interesting point above


Why does the clanking/groaning noise come and go? - Why not all the time in 2WD?

Summer - noise disappears

Winter - Noise comes back


Service tech hear the noise on test drives. Take the car in for service. Call Toyota. Then come back after a few hours of trying to do the paperwork

- Sorry can’t hear the noise. Seems normal. "If it makes noise again". Make another appointment.


-Perhaps no permanent solution? Toyota refusing to pay dealership for a repair bound to fail again?


Note that this thread isn’t about T4r engines/transmission reliability.


Thinking out loud

 

Appreciate the thought/input. To clarify, my post was mainly just to let people see that the fix can be covered under warranty. I've seen plenty of other posts where people have had difficulties getting the dealership to admit there's a problem, but this is a case where it can happen. Yes you have to be patient with a few visits to Toyota while they go through their troubleshooting process and contact their tech support.....it's the 'joy' of dealing with corporations. The ultimate decision is up to each owner on how much of that they want to deal with versus spending their own $$$ to fix Toyota's problem.

For my T4R's situation, the noise was sort of a rotational whomp whomp type sound. The sound does not disappear in the summer and it had been a constant since last winter. The sound was becoming more prominent over the last few months and it's much easier to confirm the 2WD vs 4WD test situations in the winter when roads are snowy. Initially I had also done some testing to rule out a tire problem by rotating the spare tire in for a few days to see if the noise went away (it did not). I debated draining the front diff fluid, but I figured I wanted Toyota to see whatever metal shavings might have been floating in there.

The diff swap seems like an extreme way to fix the issue, but it's on their dime. We'll see how long it lasts. I'm hoping this is the last of that problem or at least lasts until I install a lift and replace the bearing with an ECSS bushing.

Agreed....this problem has absolutely nothing to do with the reliability of the T4R engine or transmission.

I thought I had another good needle bearing post bookmarked from another forum that helped explain the observed bearing noise differences when in 2WD vs 4WD, but it's escaping me. I'll add in later if I can find it since it was also a good resource.

 

My experiences has been that the service tech heard the noise on a test drive with me. Same rotational whomp whomp
Tech said... "Thought the bearing issue had been fixed, so still happening"

However, after keeping the T4R in service bay for a whole day.
The checkout ticket says cant reproduce. Bring it back if still happening.

My thought is maybe they cant get Toyota to cover the cost.

 

I read through this entire thread and wanted to drop this here because I am having a somewhat similar issue.

2021 4Runner ORP: After a 2.5 / 2.0 Bilstein kit and alignment I noticed when I let my foot off the gas when going > 25 MPH up to ~ 65 mph their is a growl and it feels like their is some sort of resistance coming from the front end. Sounds and feels like keeping a manual in to low of gear for to long. Any ideas what is causing the issue? Thanks in advance.

 

Have you tried shifting into 4H when it's making the growl? If you do, and the growl stops, it's the needle bearing.

 

I have not, but I will today. I appreciate the response and will let y'all know how it turns out. Thank you.

 

Drove it today and followed the guidance of engaging 4-HI. It completely stoped the issue. Any recommendations when I speak with the dealership? I will provide a copy of the TSB when I go. I appreciate all the information I found here. Very helpful.

 

^Best way to approach a dealer is to verbally regurgitate the problem description in the TSB, so the service writer can find it in his system. i.e. don't wave the TSB in his face. The technician still needs to drive the vehicle and confirm the issue. If you have doubts, ask to ride along so you can point out the vibration.

Dealer may still tell you it isn't covered under warranty because you have a lift installed. I'm sure the service writer will be happy to print out a $600 estimate for you.

 

Fair enough. I appreciate the information and quick response. Thank you. I have service scheduled for Friday, and a technician is going to ride with me. I guess either way it needs to be corrected. It would be nice if they cover the repair.

 

^You know that Einstein saying about insanity?

The only reason to go to the dealer is if they cover the repair under warranty free of charge. Replacing your needle bearing with another one is not likely to solve your problem long-term.

 

As far as a long term solution …. Getting rid of the lift?

 

^Replace the needle bearing with a sintered bronze bushing, proven over two decades: https://eastcoastgearsupply.com/i-8536125-toyota-8-clamshell-bushing-eliminates-needle-bearing.html

 

Oh, wow. Thank you. Sounds like that is the way to go! I am looking at them now. Again, thank you for the responses.

 

If its a needle bearing issue, the dealership will replace it with the same part. They wont install any aftermarket piece even if it is far superior than stock parts.

 

If you aren't handy enough to DIY this install, go to an indie shop.

 

I would hate to have this issue every 15k miles.

 

I didn't see if you mentioned where you are. If you let us know, someone near you may have gone down this road before with a dealership fix, and may have input as to how it went.

 

I am also following the 2022 Needle Bearing thread which has some good information.

 

There is a TSB for my 2021.

From what I could gather, differentials manufactured before a certain date in 2022 are affected.

 

Do you have the link to the TSB? Also, did you find it using your VIN? How do you determine when the differential was manufactured? Any information will be helpful. TIA.

 

I did a search using my VIN.

It took some searching but it was near the top of the list. I'll get on my laptop where I downloaded it to get the number.

file:///C:/Users/shoppingmc/Downloads/4Runner%20TSB.pdf

Can't make it work as a link. Copy and paste will bring it up, at least on a PC.

 

Thank you, @RUNNER4DAN. I will give it a shot. So far, no TSB for my VIN, unfortunately. I have an appointment tomorrow, so we will see how it goes.

Update: Tech drove it and could hear and feel it. They want to swap tires to and go through process of elimination. So here we are, waiting. They put on tires from a 4R on the lot. Same problem. Nothing changed.

 

Why are these monkeys so stupid? Put it in 4hi and the noise goes away… that proves it’s not due to tire